|
|
orzie
Responsible
Supreme Hero
|
posted January 11, 2017 05:07 PM |
|
Edited by orzie at 17:16, 11 Jan 2017.
|
Quote:
Probably thousands of hours where spent on this project and all out of passion.
I think hundreds, but it's still may seem too much for an ordinary fan of the game. I also left behind my personal relationships to be able to work on the project more in the end of 2014.
(well, that was not the only reason for putting down the relationships, but still)
Quote:
I may help doing plugins if real time allow.
all my plugins yet are open source (that mean code is availible, i didn't estabilished any licence), partially because it's noble partially because part of them are derivated work, so my updates to feanors plugins ought to be open source.
That's probably no problem. Feanor is freely sharing his developments, and it would be stupid for me to say anything about that, sometimes the community is important.
Quote:
If I get the code for SW and you allow me to use it in public, I may try to backport them to common ERA (SW is very uncommon version of ERA with much of added content, am i right?).
I don't understand some points. The Succession Wars in its structure still remains an ERA portable mod. The official release will just not have the toolset usually coming with ERA 2.46 and will have our own EXE files for the game and the map editor. The EXEs are patched (probably, not so much in the case of h3sw.exe).
So, H3SW is based solely on ERA 2.46 and the only difference is in the patched EXEs.
We already got an oral permission from Berserker, the creator of ERA, to distribute the project in the abovementioned way. We intend this kind of distribution to be the primary way, to provide people unskilled in Heroes 3 modding the easiest installation.
Programming help, however, may come in handy soon.
____________
|
|
Macron1
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted January 11, 2017 07:59 PM |
|
|
robizeratul said:
Those who attack Orzie need to realize that he(and others) is doing this for free.
Kivo was doing it for free and released playable version to public.
Now it's few years and still no release. And if you look into DF2 forum, most of the creatures announced still have no animation at all.
That's what buzz is about. Some are afraid SW will not publish anything at all like many previous big mods (and not only for HMM3) ended.
When you are doing it's for free, there are some sources projects (like on GitHub) and at any time there is possibility to download current unstable version and check it.
But SW team had choosen HOTA crew approach, when there is something hidden is going under shadows, resulting in few photoshopped screenshoots and no real product for years/months. Like some secret cult.
robizeratul said:
Instead of watching a movie, relaxing with his friends/family or dating his girlfriend etc he has decided to create something for us. He is (literally) giving away part of his life for this project. Probably thousands of hours where spent on this project and all out of passion.
And maybe these all spent time will go to waste, because at some point he will decide not to publish his works due to some imaginary problems.
robizeratul said:
Anyone who has that kind of passion deserves respect. Double respect for that fact that it's not very popular, he doesn't have thousands cheering him on ...he has dozens and dozens of dedicated fans. It's not easy working like that,not knowing how many people will care about your hard work, and it's a testament to his character that he is still here.
Will wait for first release of new crew first.
Orzie, I don't mean aggression, this is just critics of choosen "elitary mod" approach.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted January 11, 2017 09:42 PM |
|
|
Macron1 said:
Orzie, I don't mean aggression, this is just critics of choosen "elitary mod" approach.
Please understand that when you have a very precise vision you can't just github and have random people contributing, and if these people work in a different direction than yours it will only delay the release even further, create conflicts and worst case scenario but not improbable end the project altogether. When within a team human resources are crucial and everybody needs to be on the same page.
You say you don't mean aggression, but while we are waiting for the mod to release doing nothing they are the ones working their *** off in order to deliver us an awesome experience, and as long as the principal team members are saying they keep on working and are motivated to release a new version as soon as they deem it worth, any fear about project being dead is unjustified, and remarks on the matter come out as rude at the very least.
____________
|
|
Wind_Falcon
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 09:52 AM |
|
|
And you have to realize that no one is attacking Orzie.
Just because they are doing it for free doesn't exempt them from criticism, questions, suggestions etc. After all, they care about the quality of their work (otherwise, why bother at all?), and all these are a natural process of achieving said quality.
White knighting will only result in a weaker final product. Leave the devs (and more importantly, their work) to speak for themselves (itself).
I'm pretty sure everyone here respects the devs and the time and effort they have put into the mod, that goes without question. It's exactly from this respect that the "harsher" comments are coming, even if you disagree if that's how it should or shouldn't be expressed. In the end of the day, everyone wants them to succeed and release a great mod.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 10:20 AM |
|
|
Wind_Falcon said:
I'm pretty sure everyone here respects the devs and the time and effort they have put into the mod, that goes without question.
I don't think it goes without question coming from the people whining they don't release a broken or unfinished mod, but this topic has been derailed further enough.
____________
|
|
Wind_Falcon
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 10:30 AM |
|
|
You can think whatever you want, even if its not true.
Then if you don't have anything to say on topic, don't derail it with attempts to delegitimize other people's legit comments.
I'm fine with agreeing to disagree, but people are starting to act a bit petty and childish (I won't say nasty, just yet at least).
Though I feel as if I'm repeating myself.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 10:45 AM |
|
Edited by Galaad at 10:46, 12 Jan 2017.
|
Quote:
Then if you don't have anything to say on topic, don't derail it with attempts to delegitimize other people's legit comments.
No, when I say this:
Quote:
Please understand that when you have a very precise vision you can't just github and have random people contributing, and if these people work in a different direction than yours it will only delay the release even further, create conflicts and worst case scenario but not improbable end the project altogether. When within a team human resources are crucial and everybody needs to be on the same page.
I'm also replying to this kind of comments:
Quote:
I really think that by this point its better to release what they have and keep working on it while there is something out there to build a community around
And I am not the one insisting and coming back on a topic my friend already said he considered closed.
Peace out.
____________
|
|
Wind_Falcon
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 10:53 AM |
|
|
And I said I'm fine with posts like this.
You can go back and count how many times I've posted in the thread and on the different discussions. I don't think I've posted more than 3 times regarding my "release as you work suggestion", and I think I expressed it in a pretty civil way. The reaction to it was more of an attack than anything else, which could have made my replies to be in the same manner as a response. There is no need for people to go all "holier than thou" moralizing about it and stoop to stuff like "whining".
I also said the topic is closed (numerous times), but other people keep bringing it up.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 10:57 AM |
|
|
Your first sentence in this thread is:
Quote:
Sadly we probably wont be getting the mod this year either. I'm skeptical for 2017 as well.
Maybe you have a language barrier or something but this pretty much sounds like whining to me. Also, I was not even replying to you but to Macron, I wonder why you felt targeted.
____________
|
|
Wind_Falcon
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 11:02 AM |
|
|
You keep responding in bad faith.
My initial comment was mainly addressing stuff robizeratul brought up.
I also didn't get why you replied to me, other than just being nasty.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 11:07 AM |
|
|
Oh, ok, maybe you should have quoted him since his comment is on last page then, usually in this forum when people post a reply straight underneath someone else's comment, it is targeted at him. Well I hope we're done.
____________
|
|
Wind_Falcon
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 11:09 AM |
|
|
|
I don't quote because my responses are meant to address the general sentiments expressed as a whole in the discussion, and not the various individuals expressing them.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 11:12 AM |
|
|
Wind_Falcon said:
I don't quote because my response is meant to address the general sentiment expressed, and not the individual him/herself.
Wind Falcon said:
My initial comment was mainly addressing stuff robizeratul brought up.
Make up your mind? I would suggest you to quote or tag in the future to avoid misunderstandings. 
____________
|
|
Wind_Falcon
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 11:16 AM |
|
|
I don't think there is any inconsistency in what I said. robizeratul brought up a general sentiment (you replying to me is proof of this, as are the posts before).
But we are really getting off topic here, feel free to P.M. me if you want and/or a mod to tidy the thread.
|
|
majaczek
Supreme Hero
Work at Magic Dimmension
|
|
posted January 12, 2017 09:26 PM |
|
|
|
by backporting I mean, porting the patches for more general use in ERA. So if ERA plugin or patch is done in intention of working with SW but is not easily useable in general ERA modding, I may add small changes to make it more general, in example changing "magic numbers" into input from config file and things like change abc in town xyz to change abc in any town i configured to do so etc.
|
|
e-lysander
Known Hero
Lysander
|
|
posted January 13, 2017 02:25 AM |
|
|
I've been following this project from the beginning. Hell, I even contributed some resources to an unreleased version until they were deemed unfit for purpose (fair enough, they weren't that good). Even so, I still check this thread a few times a week despite in recent years fading into the background as a lurker, but I do, to see the progress, and have done since nearly four years ago that the last version was released--that's how much I believe in this project. Heroes II has always been my favorite by far, and this mod basically takes everything good about Heroes III and puts it into Heroes II, making it potentially even better than the original game--and I've seen the evidence that this team has what it takes to make that a reality.
However, I am myself growing more concerned over time. I've taken long breaks from checking this topic (often times not by choice), and I come back only to find things in the same state as they've been. I didn't mind because there were initially semi-frequent updates that restored optimism for me in this project each, but it seems like those are few and far between, and when they do come, they tend to be in the form of short posts teasing single graphics. Regardless of any respect and patience you want to give, morale in these sort of projects erodes over time when there is nothing to show.
Maybe you have your reasons for being withholding, however I don't see why you can't simply throw us a bone--even a 30 second teaser showcasing even the basic stuff would actually be amazing and would probably tide over many.
|
|
robizeratul
Known Hero
|
|
posted January 13, 2017 11:55 AM |
|
|
|
Go to the Enroth forums, there you can see what progress is being done. New sprites, new buildings, new eveyrthing...there you can see it. They don't post every little thing here, however only in the past month multiple monsters and buildings where made!
|
|
revolut1oN
Famous Hero
|
|
posted January 13, 2017 06:05 PM |
|
|
avatar said:
This is not H2 expansion because to play SW you need have H3 installed on your hard drive, not H2. Project Ironfist is H2 expansion.
What you say completely lacks logic.
Expansion expands something.
Conversion converts.
Therefore; it is conversion of Heroes 3 and expansion to Heroes 2.
|
|
orzie
Responsible
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted January 14, 2017 08:01 AM |
|
Edited by orzie at 11:36, 14 Jan 2017.
|
revolut1oN said:
avatar said:
This is not H2 expansion because to play SW you need have H3 installed on your hard drive, not H2. Project Ironfist is H2 expansion.
What you say completely lacks logic.
Expansion expands something.
Conversion converts.
Therefore; it is conversion of Heroes 3 and expansion to Heroes 2.
Let's not cling to the words. There is a special terminology in modding, where "expansion" is generally a "2000s prototype of DLC" for a certain game with several specific attributes, often made by different developers to breathe new stream of ideas to the game. That was a rather common practice those days when the industry was only adapting to the new era. Concerning Heroes 3, only HotA can be called a fan-made expansion because it inherits (mostly) the same traits the original expansions had (Armageddon's Blade, Shadow of Death). Heroes Chronicles barely can be called expansions in their general sense for Heroes 3, because they don't bring new content.
Thanks to Cyberlore, the general traits of a HoMM expansion is new campaigns, new associated characters, new map objects/artifacts and slightly advanced gameplay. Heroes 3 by NWC inherited all of these ideas, and new H3 expansions (also by NWC) brought several new key features: new factions (if we count the Forge) and new creatures.
All other projects for Heroes of Might and Magic which concern more radical tweaks than the original expansions did, cannot be called expansions. Project Ironfist for Heroes 2 is more like WoG for Heroes 3 (bringing script language and vast opportunities for modding). It's not an expansion, it's something like "massive modification" in general. It can be called partial conversion, if you wish.
Total conversions concern (necessarily) fully replaced graphics and (not necessarily) changed/varied all other aspects. There were precedents of total conversions presented as sequels by the publisher (see X-COM: Ufo Defense and X-COM: Terror from the Deep).
Yes, H3SW in its current form is intended to have many traits from H3 expansions, such as new factions, creatures, campaigns, map objects and such, but technically it's a total conversion and must be called as such if we stick to proper definitions.
____________
|
|
orzie
Responsible
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted January 17, 2017 05:05 PM |
bonus applied by Corribus on 19 Jan 2017. |
Edited by orzie at 17:05, 17 Jan 2017.
|
And now we present the approximate bestiary of the upcoming v0.8 beta version.
Here we have 8 factions (castles, classes, whatever you call it), 7 creatures each. Note that in Heroes 2 factions had only 6 creatures, which forced us to design several new creatures even for the existing classes.
In the discussion/development process a lot of keyboards were wasted as well as a lot of genial ideas were denied. Strict limitations of the Heroes 2 concept which were responsible for the unique atmosphere and overall reception of the game had a strong influence on the content.
Of course, something may seem inappropriate for some of the players due to their personal expectations and world outlooks, but we must remind that the majority of the innovations featured in the project are made to fill the vacancies left by Heroes 3 engine, and thus, fall under the "principle of the lesser evil", so a certain creature with its place in the bestiary has its peculiar reasons.
____________
|
| |
|
|
This thread is pages long: 
