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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted September 29, 2014 11:31 AM |
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The piano solo on Coltrane's Blue Train by Kenny Drew is one of my all time favorite blues/jazz piano solos.
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markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted October 11, 2014 12:14 AM |
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Here you go JJ, from one ol' fellow to another. Enjoy...and remember.
Page
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted October 13, 2014 12:55 AM |
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Edited by cleglaw at 01:00, 13 Oct 2014.
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Dragons Child
good song, but whole album is better. i really enjoy it when i play heroes.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 10, 2014 08:00 PM |
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Boy, I guess, I really like Chopin's Piano Concerto No.2, it turns out I have two different Artur Rubinstein versions plus versions by André Watts, Krystian Zimerman, Sequiera Costa and Emanual Ax.
I'm gonna keep one version in my iPod playlist that I upload to my phone and iPad, which one would you suggest, Sal?
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 10, 2014 08:29 PM |
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All those versions are exceptional. However, there is one which is above all, is Regina Smendzianka (1924-2011). If you want to hear how piano sounds from heaven, listen THIS from 14:25. When Chopin is in the fingers, is great. But when is in the blood, fingers become misty.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 10, 2014 08:58 PM |
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She's really good. Too bad, she has no albums to download on torrent sites though.
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kayna
Supreme Hero
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posted November 12, 2014 03:43 AM |
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Salamandre said:
I don't know what you call contemporary music (which style?), for me the XXth century music, including all styles is a disastrous downgrade of everything that was done before,
I think it has something to do with all the entertainment we watch and listen as we grow up. Good old Mozart and crew had no such influences and their inspiration was close to a white canvas ; To create such musical prodigy today we would have to take a child, isolate him from the rest of the world with no tv, no internet, nothing but an instrument.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 12, 2014 04:06 AM |
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When I wrote this I was rather focusing on classical contemporary music, so not much to do with all the variety we listen to. I guess people who slobber over black paintings with a white dot in the middle are also amazed by BOULEZ SONATA, one of the most renowned and outstanding modern art-works.
And it kills my ears. And guess what: we are under pressure to perform such things. Basically a student can't finish his year if he did not play such thing.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 12, 2014 04:33 AM |
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How about Erik Satie? He can be considered contemporary by Classical music standards.
Btw, comparing it to visual arts is a little problematic I think, visual arts can get more cognitive, focus on the philosophy, the statement of the work more than music can. If we're talking about the experience of the audience, music reaches out to emotions much more directly. People rarely cry by just looking at a painting but when it comes to music, it's quite a common case.
Do you think all visual arts should be figurative?
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 12, 2014 04:43 AM |
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There are no classical music time-lines standards, but only language related. You can have a guy as Rachmaninoff being contemporary to Boulez (almost) and write Chopin style, because he is still emotionally fed by the traditional tonal language. Until ~60 years ago you could choose between tradition and modernism, depending on your taste. Now everyone walks same tempo.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 12, 2014 04:57 AM |
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Edited by artu at 04:58, 12 Nov 2014.
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But what forces that? If you are a traditionalist with good compositions, what stops you from just sitting on the piano, recording your own album and distributing it? You can even do it through Youtube. Has the genre burned out? I mean, a genius can pop up any minute but still, on the other side, all genres have a golden age where ideas are tried out, combinations follow one another but then, there is a point of saturation when not much new can be done within the conventions of that genre. Do you think that's it?
And once again, I think the traditional composers (as opposed to Boulez style) are more in the film music sector nowadays, maybe because it pays better.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 12, 2014 05:19 AM |
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Is not that simple. Music is a structured language, with its precise rules, straight fences and applications. To write Chopin style, it actually requires a few decades of study, don't think that every nice looking melody will fit, if accompanied by slow arpeggios.
Youtube is in general a fast-food platform, where everyone brags about his own big-cheese and where the number of views mislead about the quality or usefulness; for someone pretending to write and succeed in classical style, the people to convince and standards to achieve are a very different area.
You will probably have 1 million youtube fans, yet you can be totally ignored by the classical business environment, which is rather elitist and arrogant, a lot more than in variety, pop or jazz.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 12, 2014 05:35 AM |
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Edited by artu at 16:22, 12 Nov 2014.
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I know, it's not like pop music in which you compose songs simply by starting to hum a catchy tune, but let's say a talented composer chooses to go traditional style and after many years of work he decides to share his recordings through the internet. Are you suggesting he'll be lost because of lack of recognition from authorities?
The thing I'm wondering is this, prior to these last decades, classical music used to produce melodies that were also catchy, when most people hear one of the famous Mozart tunes, even if they don't know it's Mozart, they'll go "pam pam pa pam pam pa pa pa, yes, sure, I know that." Now, I always thought that was just a matter of time, 80 years from now, a classical composition published in 2003 may reach the same level of recognition, we just don't know which ones will make it, yet. But the way you talk about it as someone from the inside, it sounds like, there is a lack of creativity and quality in the field. What causes that, how do you explain your observation?
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 12, 2014 06:11 AM |
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Laziness. People agree to work but not too much. Then they agree to work a bit more, but only if it is well paid. Things changed since Mozart was working 18 hours a day, 30 consecutive years, then die from weariness. A social progress, that's it. We live better, we produce much less.
artu said:
he decides to share his recordings through the internet. Are you suggesting he'll be lost because of lack of recognition from authorities?
No, he will be lost because food privation. Look how simple is your equation: guy makes music, guy shares music, you download torrent, everybody is cheerful. But...how he lives? From where he gets money to pay bills, family?
So obviously you think music is NOT his job but rather a hobby. The question is: can you become good in that field when is only a hobby? And if it is your job, can you share it for free while enjoying enough financial independence to progress?
I doubt.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 12, 2014 11:53 AM |
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Edited by artu at 12:07, 12 Nov 2014.
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Well, no. I assume once you get known through the internet, record companies will seek you out. I know a classical composer cant get rich like Britney Spears but I estimate he can manage to turn "millions of Youtube fans" into financial profit that is enough to put food on the table. And he can manage not to die out of hunger till that happens.
It's interesting that you mention laziness. Sometime ago, I was watching an expert on Turkish music, he said everything was horrible since the 70's. When a young girl, a singer candidate asked him why and accused him of being overconservative, he replied that old generations used to work like hell but the new ones want everything ready without putting out too much effort. He quoted a very famous traditional composer's words saying that "exercise is like worship, you do it daily not weekly" (analogy is to the 5 times a day prayer of Islam).
I guess that is a very valid factor, comfort and the many distractions of modern technology indeed turn us soft and less productive to a degree.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted November 12, 2014 04:15 PM |
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artu said:
let's say a talented composer dedicated to his work chooses to go traditional style and after many years of work he decides to share his recordings through the internet.
Ok, I'm not a talented anything and lazyness is my middle name but do you think someone trying to compose will wait years if not decades to share his progresses in YouTube? Cause thats not how I see it.
You look for, starve for recognition much before acchiving the highers levels of virtuosism. He will be knowed in certain circles much before.
On the other hand, if it is a maxime of mediocrity that "genious is 10% inspiration and 90% transpirattion", I don't feel like Rimbaud was sweating much when he wrote "Une Saison en Enfer". Mozart was said to never ammend his compositions, for sure the quantity and not the quality of his compositions were affected by the fact that he was also producing 18 hours a day.
Has I said before I'm not much in the artistic department and I truly feel part of this is lack of commitment but from what I can observe some of the most perfect works of art seem to be more the produt of "divine inspiration" (the expression is ironic, I'm an atheist as I sure both of you know) then the result of hard work and dedication.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 12, 2014 04:43 PM |
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Edited by artu at 16:53, 12 Nov 2014.
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Well, "the divine inspiration" moments would be best explained with a famous Picasso anecdote. One day, he's sitting in a Paris cafe, scribbling some sketch on a paper when a woman recognizes him and approaches his table:
- Monsieur Picasso, I recognize you. Would you be kind enough to give that sketch to me as a gift, it would mean so much to me.
- Of course, madame, that would be 5000 franks.
- But... it's just something you scribbled on a cafe table in 5 minutes?!
- That would be 50 years plus 5 minutes, madame.
Yes, Rimbaud was very young when he quit poetry but it was his innovations and originality rather than his craft that got him where he was and he's definitely one of the exceptions. Besides, it was not me, it was Sal who said it takes years to be able to compose like Chopin and he's clearly more knowledgeable and experienced about this subject than any of us, so I asked a question based on his previous answer.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 12, 2014 05:19 PM |
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Prokofiev Sonata, with a friend. Italy, gorgeous belezza turning pages, was constantly distracted while inspired.
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted November 12, 2014 05:30 PM |
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artu said:
Well, "the divine inspiration" moments would be best explained with a famous Picasso anecdote. One day, he's sitting in a Paris cafe, scribbling some sketch on a paper when a woman recognizes him and approaches his table:
- Monsieur Picasso, I recognize you. Would you be kind enough to give that sketch to me as a gift, it would mean so much to me.
- Of course, madame, that would be 5000 franks.
- But... it's just something you scribbled on a cafe table in 5 minutes?!
- That would be 50 years plus 5 minutes, madame.
I can give you a much closer example: look how Sal writes a complex script nowadays and what he was doing when he wrote "Time Of Prophecy". And of course Valery Rogacev aka Sal will have that opinion: he is a piano player, that I believe The Most Sweaty Musical Instrument that exists. And you can see how that dedication and hard-work habit is present in his participation in the community, first with his maps and now with his scripts (even if here I kind of notice a small difference, his mods being publish far before the last refinements are made).
But what I wanted to know was how you (a person I feel much more in the inspirational side of the equation) felt about that?
Of course, hard-work and dedication represent a large amout of what makes an artist just think of Van Gogh, Rodin, Proust or Joyce, but do you think is mostly hard-work that results into works like the one's of Bach, Shakespeare or (pardon me some possible tendency) Camões?
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 12, 2014 05:36 PM |
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I think it's a combination of intelligence, imagination, sensitivity, depth and dedication.
Not all these qualities are distributed equally in an artist, some impress us more with original ideas, others with emotional depth, some are simply masterful at their craft and impressive in a "how can one do that?" way, while others can manage to astonish us with a unique simplicity. But if an artist is great, I think he has his share of all the qualities above to some extent.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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This thread is pages long: 
