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The_Green_Drag
Supreme Hero
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posted August 16, 2016 05:39 PM |
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Elvin said:
Ubi has systematically destroyed faction uniqueness and diversity despite their claims of pushing for it. It's not even about the tiers, skill system or growth, it's just a matter of terrible visualization and implementation.
Diversity has always been part of heroes' charm but everything is so uniform and artificial to the point of bordering on soulless now.
Yeah and it really kills the replay value when every run through feels more or less the same. Nothing is unique anymore, you find duplicates of everything. How many ranged champions do we have now? How many multi-tile attacking units are there? Idk which factions got the strongest tier 6, they're all the flippin same! How far does that one unit move? If it's not 5, its six, and vice versa. Which champion is the most expensive?...they all are...cause they all cost the same..
But hey this mobile game looks promising  
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted August 16, 2016 05:41 PM |
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Antalyan said:
Generally, the world "CAN" has very strange meaning in this community
Antalyan said:
Community is certainly partly to blame.
Antalyan said:
This is how the opinions about this community being conservative are born
Antalyan said:
this community looks like from outside as it looks like - conservative and punctilious.
just something worth you, the bloke with the H5 priest avatar (whatshisface) and or whoever else trying to understand, is that "this community" can't have opinions because it isn't a hivemind or a single entity lol
so please let all take care not to fall back on vague passive aggressive style soundbites IHMO,
if you look to disagree with what someone said, specify the persons, for instance, we wouldn't be valid to say, H7 Steam Forums are delusional, as forums do not have brains, but we could say, some of the specific members at H7 Steam Forums are delusional people,
what you are referring to here, is not the mythical "this community" but rather a subset of specific, individual members who share some opinions, within a further subset of the Heroes fanbase at best, and also a subset of members, who don't really care what random hypothetical people who may or may not exist think of them lol
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3lion
Known Hero
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posted August 16, 2016 07:57 PM |
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Elvin said:
but everything is so uniform and artificial to the point of bordering on soulless now.
You just grown old.
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Creature Scale mod (patch 2.2.1 compatible)
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LizardWarrior
Honorable
Legendary Hero
the reckoning is at hand
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posted August 16, 2016 07:59 PM |
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Well, I think that too and I'm younger than Elvin 
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BurntPhoenix
Hired Hero
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posted August 16, 2016 08:03 PM |
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Elvin said:
I forgot emeralds but damn, they even surpass gold dragons! This is plain bizarre, the necro dragons have always been the weakest champion.
H2?
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3lion
Known Hero
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posted August 16, 2016 08:04 PM |
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Edited by 3lion at 20:05, 16 Aug 2016.
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LizardWarrior said:
Well, I think that too and I'm younger than Elvin
Physically? Or mentally?
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Creature Scale mod (patch 2.2.1 compatible)
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LizardWarrior
Honorable
Legendary Hero
the reckoning is at hand
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posted August 16, 2016 08:12 PM |
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I haven't witnessed as many winters
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted August 16, 2016 09:47 PM |
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Edited by Elvin at 21:49, 16 Aug 2016.
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BurntPhoenix said:
Elvin said:
I forgot emeralds but damn, they even surpass gold dragons! This is plain bizarre, the necro dragons have always been the weakest champion.
H2?
Touche, H2 phoenixes were on the delicate side 
3lion said:
Elvin said:
but everything is so uniform and artificial to the point of bordering on soulless now.
You just grown old.
Some people grow, others mature 
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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cori14
Adventuring Hero
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posted August 16, 2016 10:55 PM |
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Edited by cori14 at 23:03, 16 Aug 2016.
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Although I don't agree with everything he said it's a very interesting video about "what should be in a Heroes game". Sadly it's russian, but at least he made a subtitle, so we can understand it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddAm9Zc-un4
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yogi
Promising
Famous Hero
of picnics
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posted August 17, 2016 02:39 AM |
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IF YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND ALL THE NUANCES OF THE CORE MECHANICS OF HEROES OF MIGHT AND MAGIC AS DEFINED BY THE PRINCIPLE MOLD LAID OUT IN THE FIRST THREE GAMES, PRETENDING TO KNOW BETTER THAN THOSE THAT PRECEDE YOU JUST WEAKENS FUTURE ITERATIONS IN THE FRANCHISE! THIS APPLIES TO BOTH FANS AND DEVS. HEROES OF MIGHT AND MAGIC, JUST LIKE CHESS OR ANY OTHER GAME, IS DEFINED BY THE CHOICES AVAILABLE TO A PLAYER, AND THE WAYS IN WHICH THOSE DECISIONS INFLUENCE OTHER PLAYERS. IF YOU CHANGE THE MANNER IN WHICH A PIECE MOVES, YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT GAME!! RESTRUCTURING THE TITLE OF THE FRANCHISE TO M&M:H WAS THE PINNACLE ARROGANT ACT THAT SIGNED THE DEATH WARRANT ON THE MIRACULOUS HEROES OF MIGHT AND MAGIC. THANKFULLY, FOR THE MIRACULOUS, DEATH IS JUST A BEGINNING 
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yogi - class: monk | status: healthy
"Lol we are HC'ers.. The same tribe.. Guy!" ~Ghost
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted August 17, 2016 11:19 AM |
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Yogi, I think it's time for a new keyboard. Your CAPS LOCK key seems to be stuck.
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The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker
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lordgraa
Promising
Famous Hero
The Whisperer
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posted August 17, 2016 11:39 AM |
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Side question: Do you think they will ever finish the MMH7 blog? Seems like Dwarves won`t get their page... I know... who cares about hamsters... back to game files to export it all by myself so at least fansites will be complete.
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World of Heroes (Czech fansite)
The Shadows Over Ashan (H7 community DLC)
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted August 17, 2016 11:44 AM |
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game is really fun imho(i have some freetime lately, and i spent 6 hours today on h7 because i was like "one more turn before i do X" and i just couldnt stop playing.) BUT! all those bugs are... overwhelming. random twice shootings, random turn skippings, randomly not working abilities, no retaliation creatures retaliating randomly... ruin this great experience.
i dont really mind balance issues too much, but bugs.. bugs are really annoying. i would be really happy if those bugs got cleared  i hope i dont have to wait 1 another year to get a fully-working h7.
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hahakocka
Known Hero
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posted August 17, 2016 11:52 AM |
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Random turn skipping . Bad morale? I ha in campaign yesterday.
No retaliation : I had a no retaliation weeek yesterday in the game.
Some bugs appeared me too i must set sometimes my ballista on it was off before the battle sometimes.
HVi and HVIi has other composerrs as well. (Jason Greaves, Roch Chen etc) Thats is why not the same quantity in music. Paul's work is the true one! And they have (Paul and Rob) less time and theme to work on these times sadly.
Though i think H2 and H3 are outdated but not on graphics or music or on the technical side. But on gameplay mechanics and equal possibility to win for everyone were missing there. And few factions (Barbarian Necropolis) has utterly bigger power and advantage with you can build Behemoth on the 3.-4. day or higher rank necropolis creatures. With other nations you can not built tier 7 creature. Also many things is hanged only on Luck! The skills, that how you got them good or bads based on luck only, many times it gave bad but mainly because not so many useful skills were there. (it is now in H7 they fixed the random skill system too in patches) These were generally featured on the official tournament multiplayer maps mainly. (In Dragon Utopia many times appeared to get mainly nothing efficient.). Sometimes you have great free or not hardly defended artifacts on one side , on the other player's side nothing. Also the creatures balanced not well. Some creatures worth nothing (Wights) some (thousands of skeletons) worth every penny and necromancy point.
in the criticised H6-H7 every creature has good points and an advantage for use it. in H6 even good active and passive skills can be used as well as it was in H4. Sadly they reduced them in number for the H3 fans in H7. Diversity were happened at the H6 creatures because of that.
In H6-H7 many good skils are can choosed, Also in H5. H2-H3 hasnt got so many kind of skills at all. Also not much useful one. (H6-H7 150 skills may be in all and the majoritxy can be useful)
These are not perfect Heroes games as well, i liked the H4 spell and hero skill system better for example and the music of course. (other things not so...
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AnkVaati
Famous Hero
Nighonese National Front
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posted August 17, 2016 12:20 PM |
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Edited by AnkVaati at 12:24, 17 Aug 2016.
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cori14 said:
Although I don't agree with everything he said it's a very interesting video about "what should be in a Heroes game". Sadly it's russian, but at least he made a subtitle, so we can understand it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddAm9Zc-un4
Great video! A must see.
verriker said:
what you are referring to here, is not the mythical "this community" but rather a subset of specific, individual members who share some opinions, within a further subset of the Heroes fanbase at best, and also a subset of members, who don't really care what random hypothetical people who may or may not exist think of them lol
Summed up my own idea of a good Heroes game sometime ago:
From Heroes 1-4:
- Creature system like Heroes 4 (with choices), but with at least two additional tiers as well and probably more choices as well.
- Heroes that fight on the battlefield, if this can be balanced properly
- Additional hero classes with additional bonuses depending on skills (like in Heores 4)
- Caravans - possibly visible on the map (can be robbed, raided if a lucky enemy encounters them)
- Alignments. Theme-based towns that gives the feeling of "classic fantasy".
- Terry B. Ray's terrific writing! (back to Axeoth and finally tell us what happened with all these amazing characters)
From Heroes 5-7:
- Initiative system
- H5's skill system and magic schools
- Alternative upgrades (for some, not all creatures should even have upgrades IMHO)
- The fact that your actions can influence some kind of personal alignment
- Control zones
- Tech tree (in some shape or form)
- Unique war machines
Additional:
- Neutral factions that can be interacted with
- Diplomacy between factions
- More random events/quests
^all of the above should be optional for the people who want a more pure strategy game
- Semi-towns for smaller factions that don't really need a full-fledged faction of their own.
- Easy modability. Think Stellaris or other Paradox games.
.... Leul, half of the list comes from le Ubi games. I'm sure most members won't agree even remotely with me on some of this ideas, especially considering my fondness of Heroes 4. Being Ashanosceptic doesn't say a lot about your ideas about a good heroes game really. That, or I guess I'm an errant spore of the HC hive cluster.
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Ank's Old School (kinda) H8 proposal <- best thing evvah, trust me
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted August 17, 2016 12:26 PM |
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cleglaw said:
BUT! all those bugs are... overwhelming. random twice shootings, random turn skippings, randomly not working abilities, no retaliation creatures retaliating randomly... ruin this great experience.
Bug or feature? 
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
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posted August 17, 2016 02:47 PM |
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verriker said:
Antalyan said:
Generally, the world "CAN" has very strange meaning in this community
Antalyan said:
Community is certainly partly to blame.
Antalyan said:
This is how the opinions about this community being conservative are born
Antalyan said:
this community looks like from outside as it looks like - conservative and punctilious.
just something worth you, the bloke with the H5 priest avatar (whatshisface) and or whoever else trying to understand, is that "this community" can't have opinions because it isn't a hivemind or a single entity lol
so please let all take care not to fall back on vague passive aggressive style soundbites IHMO,
if you look to disagree with what someone said, specify the persons, for instance, we wouldn't be valid to say, H7 Steam Forums are delusional, as forums do not have brains, but we could say, some of the specific members at H7 Steam Forums are delusional people,
what you are referring to here, is not the mythical "this community" but rather a subset of specific, individual members who share some opinions, within a further subset of the Heroes fanbase at best, and also a subset of members, who don't really care what random hypothetical people who may or may not exist think of them lol
I won't argue with you but I will definitely not use "a subset of specific, individual members who share some opinions, within a further subset of the Heroes fanbase at best, and also a subset of members, who don't really care what random hypothetical people who may or may not exist think of them" in my every second post I mention community. You can read the description of what community means onWikipedia.
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Important H7 tips & tricks
H7 Community Patch (UCP)
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Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
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posted August 17, 2016 02:54 PM |
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Elvin said:
cleglaw said:
BUT! all those bugs are... overwhelming. random twice shootings, random turn skippings, randomly not working abilities, no retaliation creatures retaliating randomly... ruin this great experience.
Bug or feature?
They might have finally added "random events" many people asked for
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Important H7 tips & tricks
H7 Community Patch (UCP)
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted August 17, 2016 03:24 PM |
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Antalyan said:
I won't argue with you but I will definitely not use "a subset of specific, individual members who share some opinions, within a further subset of the Heroes fanbase at best, and also a subset of members, who don't really care what random hypothetical people who may or may not exist think of them" in my every second post I mention community. You can read the description of what community means onWikipedia.
in this context, the net being cast in these "this community" musings is often so broad, you could easily be on about Heroes Community itself, HC plus certain sites, the entire online HoMM fanbase, three HC users, three thousand users from all around, the whole gaming community except yourself, the whole gaming community plus yourself, or god only knows lol
so, if you want to accomplish something to not just complain, it can be quite helpful to focus your criticisms and get a discussion with a human IMHO,
like for instance one might say, "verriker, Galaad, Datapack, Gryphs, although you guys are all absolutely hilarious, witty and humble, I feel your lampoonery of Erwin all the time may lack depth and paint the wider fanbase in an unflattering light, maybe you would reconsider" lol
none of us are in a hivemind of bees, Zerg Colony, street gang or even a group at all, we are all just random users focusing on ourselves and getting across our own notions, therefore nobody is very likely to take you seriously and reevaluate their behavior as an individual, if someone is just mumbling in vague terms about "this community" lol
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hahakocka
Known Hero
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posted August 17, 2016 03:37 PM |
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H5 Iniative system was not real good i think. Sometimes unpredictable as the speed system in h4 too!
And also there were some creature who can move 4 times in a row. (and he had only 1 more iniative speed than mine what an advantage is that...)
I liked The spell and hero skill system in H4 the most.
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This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
