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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted January 24, 2006 03:33 AM |
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What A Brilliant Idea . . .
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If I were them, I should choose another place to settle.
. . . perhaps Germany or Alaska . . . right? I think I am beginning to understand your logic.
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted January 24, 2006 05:45 PM |
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Quote:
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If I were them, I should choose another place to settle.
. . . perhaps Germany or Alaska . . . right? I think I am beginning to understand your logic.
If I understand you rigth, you accuse me to hate jews! If so:
1. I DONT HATE JEWS!!!
2. If I hated jews i should not want to have them in germany (Germany lie very near Sweden, if you don't now that)
3. If they wanted a land, they coud have choosen another who dont lie in arabic lands.
4. The text who the moderator indicted red was just a joke!
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted January 24, 2006 05:55 PM |
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. . . perhaps Germany or Alaska . . . right? I think I am beginning to understand your logic.
Or perhaps within the 55 % of Palestine they were so generously donated in '48, instead of attempting to finish the "bantustanization" of Gaza and the West Bank?
Or amaybe it's Israel's Manifest Destiny to colonize the few remaining parts of Palestine?
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted January 24, 2006 05:59 PM |
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Quote:
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. . . perhaps Germany or Alaska . . . right? I think I am beginning to understand your logic.
Or perhaps within the 55 % of Palestine they were so generously donated in '48, instead of attempting to finish the "bantustanization" of Gaza and the West Bank?
Or amaybe it's Israel's Manifest Destiny to colonize the few remaining parts of Palestine?
That should be rigth if they did it! I hope that next Israelish president will stop the palestines reclaming the West bank and Gaza!
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TNT_Addict
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Beautiful Liar
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posted January 24, 2006 06:02 PM |
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I don't see any other country which returns lands they won in a bloody war.
Israels additional land was established after an all out attack in purpose of total
anihilation of all the israely people by the 4 big arab neighbour countries!
And now they want to get all the strategic landmarks back so they can threaten us again?
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted January 24, 2006 06:04 PM |
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hat should be rigth if they did it! I hope that next Israelish president will stop the palestines reclaming the West bank and Gaza!
Whoa. The Palestinians have a chance of reclaiming Gaza or the West Bank? I didn't know that.
And would you please try to tone down that racist hate you're spreading about Muslims, Arabs and other Semite peoples? I, and probably many with me, would greatly appreciate it. Keeping a civil tone is clever if you want people to listen to what you're saying, you know.
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I don't see any other country which returns lands they won in a bloody war.
Well, according to international law, war is not a legitimate way of expanding one's borders.
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Israels additional land was established after an all out attack in purpose of total
anihilation of all the israely people by the 4 big arab neighbour countries!
I don't deny that. In fact, I don't think anyone's denying that. At least, the territory gained before 1967 was taken after such a war. That war in 1973 and after, I'm not so sure about, though. It's a debated issue, as you probably know.
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And now they want to get all the strategic landmarks back so they can threaten us again?
"They"? Who "they"?
The neighbouring contries? The Palestinians? Please elaborate.
Not that you need to, since the situation has changed dramatically since those wars.
Ugh, I try not to do this...
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted January 24, 2006 06:09 PM |
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Quote:
I don't see any other country which returns lands they won in a bloody war.
Israels additional land was established after an all out attack in purpose of total
anihilation of all the israely people by the 4 big arab neighbour countries!
And now they want to get all the strategic landmarks back so they can threaten us again?
Yes! The barbarians are brutal and want to kill Israelites for their jihhad! Here home the stupid folish youts frome Left Youth Union who screems about how pity it is for their favorite barbarians and how mutch they hate jews. (I began to wonder if they are nazis actually! But feminism and nazism is the same so it isn't strange that they also hate jews)
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TNT_Addict
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Beautiful Liar
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posted January 24, 2006 06:11 PM |
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Point out one racist word plz... If you can that is...
And I wasn't talking only about palestinians that are voting for a terror organization to lead their country
I was talking about the 4 wars that already was and could be repeated!
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted January 24, 2006 06:14 PM |
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Whoa. The Palestinians have a chance of reclaiming Gaza or the West Bank? I didn't know that.
And would you please try to tone down that racist hate you're spreading about Muslims, Arabs and other Semite peoples? I, and probably many with me, would greatly appreciate it. Keeping a civil tone is clever if you want people to listen to what you're saying, you know.
Fortunately, don't all of it. Jerusalem will remain to be the Israelitic capitol and mutch of the West bank will still be in israelitic hands! But the Palestines will have the tactical advantge if they attack, particular if they are supported by their barbarian brothers (Syria)
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted January 24, 2006 06:29 PM |
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Point out one racist word plz... If you can that is...
Actually, I was talking to fortress_fan here, which I suppose you could have fiigured out for yourself if you'd bothered to check.
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And I wasn't talking only about palestinians that are voting for a terror organization to lead their country I was talking about the 4 wars that already was and could be repeated!
And the difference between voting for Hamas and voting for Netanyahu, is...?
Enlighten me, please.
As for the wars, they can't be repeated. Israel is one of the worlds five strongest military powers, while none of your neighbours come close to that.
And which neighbours, by the way? Let's see...
Egypt - attacking Israel without Soviet support? Yeah, right, because Egypt is so independent from US support...
Saudi Arabia - US lapdog. Fascits who only stay in power because the US benefits from having them there.
Iraq - uh?
Iran - how'd they get there? They could of course nuke you, but then you'd just nuke them back, and I doubt they'd risk that.
Lebanon - the last time I checked, they had enough problems as it is. And I doubt they'd try anything, seeing as Israeli forces are positioned on their borders.
Turkey - they want to join the EU, and attacking Europe's pet state wonæt help them achieve that objective...
Which basically leaves Jordan and Syria - and they're a threat to Israel how, exactly?
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Fortunately, don't all of it. Jerusalem will remain to be the Israelitic capitol and mutch of the West bank will still be in israelitic hands!
Sadly, you're right. The retreat from Gaza was an excellent play for the gallery, which allowed Israel to almost unnoticed tear down half of Eastern Jerusalem, confiscate a few more Palestinian fields for their Apartheid Wall, pull up a couple of thousand olive trees, build some more colonies in the West Bank, and bomb the northern parts of Gaza to "establish a security perimeter" - which is something usually done on one's own territory. Israel sure gets a lot of good will for their "good deeds", eh?
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But the barbarians will have the tactical advantge if they attack, particular if they are supported by their barbarian brothers (Syria)
See above. Neither Syria nor the Palestinians have nuclear weapons combined with an immense disrespect for basic human rights and international treaties.
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted January 24, 2006 06:59 PM |
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Why do you support the palestines? Are you a MOSLEM?!!
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Lich_King
Honorable
Supreme Hero
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posted January 24, 2006 07:13 PM |
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Why do you support the palestines? Are you a MOSLEM?!!
I think that he is no muslim, but he has an opinion biased on somekind of observations and I'm sure he is responsible for defending that opinion, even though you think it's incorrect, but you mustn't forget that your attitude and replies are quite immature, especially the way you put them into discussion... And especially like those I quoted above...
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fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted January 24, 2006 07:21 PM |
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Ehhhhem... Are the moderator supporting him?
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Lich_King
Honorable
Supreme Hero
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posted January 24, 2006 07:27 PM |
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I'm not moderating this part of forum and I'm not supporting, I'm pointing out that your replies are immature and asperse...
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted January 24, 2006 08:36 PM |
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Edited by Consis on 24 Jan 2006
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*chuckles* . . .
"Manifest Destiny", heh, That's a good one terje_the_mad_wizard. I understood your meaning.
But really now, you think you can keep to the claim that Israel is the world's 5th most powerful nation? Methinks you haven't done your math or your proper hypothesis. Regardless of nuclear might, their numbers are low and they have the unique ability to unite the entire Muslim world against them. It's a worst case scenario yes, but still very likely should they decide to use a nuclear weapon.
I also find your perception of U.S./Israeli relations far from accurate. Iran is truly dangerous but not because of nuclear weapons they might be in the process of making. It is because of how the rest of the world sees them. I think the rest of the world sees them with a great deal of pity. Should the U.S. ever become solely involved in a war against them then I believe it would be the straw that breaks the camel's back. My country has done so poorly since President Carter left office in regards to foreign relations. Reagan angered many, Bush brought back China, then Clinton ignored China, and now "Dubbya" has gone and spent the tolerance of non-Americans. People do in fact have a lot of resentment to our country for its oil endeavors and war in Iraq. You are correct to this. But do not be too quick to assume this country would be willing to lay nuclear warfare upon the doorstep of the Iranians.
Take me for example, if I thought that we might actually do such a thing then I would be the first to come out of my domestic cubbyhole to stop it. I am proud to be an Oregonian; home to the likes of a once great United States senator named Mark Hatfield. And I shan’t think twice about rising to meet the challenge of global nuclear war for my children and my children's children.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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dkolb
Promising
Known Hero
Nay Nay and Aslan Protector
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posted January 24, 2006 11:43 PM |
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my "brainwashed" opinion: there are tons of people that wish Israel harm. Why? I don't know they have been fighting since Ishmael and Isaac. It doesn't matter why, they just do and are willing to blow themselves up to cause civilian casualties. If we withdrew all our support they aren't going to have a top 5 army and I think it is safe to assume Israel would be destroyed. A genocide is much worse than what it going on now IMO.
That being said...
Israel operates under an "eye for an eye" philosophy.
Basically if a suicide bomber attacks Israel, a mob of Israelites is going to blindly kill whoever attacked them. Sometime the attacks aren't even against those responsible.
However ethically right or wrong it is, peace usually isn't in the equation.
In someways it is vigilante justice.
So I think we need to keep supporting Israel to avoid an even greater evil. But it's not easy supporting them and sometimes they don't do very "PC" or "diplomatic" things.
Just my two cents
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SirDunco
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted January 25, 2006 01:18 PM |
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Look the fact is that Isreal has one of most modern armies in the world. And still the US goverment gives founds to the Isreali military. Israel the best equiped and probably the strongest army in the region apart from the fact that it owns nuclear and hydrogen weapons. Theoreticaly they have the power to wipe out most of their neighboors, but that will hopefully not happen.
The problem is with the people who rule Israel. Since Ytzhak Rabin and Simon Perez Israel has had only ultra conservative politicians to be prime minister. The on going war in Israel is just an outcome of the historical and political situation.
The Palestinias will never back down since thier land was unjustly taken from them and settled by someone else. The Israeli goverment forced them out of their homes so the radicalization of the Palestinians is a logical outcome. I strongly dissagree with what Hammas is doing but the Intifada is so far the most working way for them to get back at Israel since , maybee until now, it has been quite unwilling to back down to their requests... Terrorism is wrong, but what is worse when it is done by an outlawed group or by an Army.
The fact is that the Israeli Army acts just like Hammas, with the only difference that it's actions are backed by it's goverment and under ordeder of generals.
An amry has no right to act is such an order. When a suicidal bomber kills him self in the middle of Tel Aviv taking 10 with him, does the army have the right to come and kill 5 or 10 people, among them women and children? An Army or any instiution controled by the goverment has no right, political or moral to behave like that.
The problem is that this will not end soon since niether side has the will to back down. The palestinians will keep on fighting for their land and people while the Israelis will fight for the land taken from the Palestinians and ofcoruse to defend their people.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted January 25, 2006 03:02 PM |
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Hmm . . .
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Look the fact is that Isreal has one of most modern armies in the world.
This is true.
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Israel is the best equipped and probably the strongest army in the region apart from the fact that it owns nuclear weapons.
I agree, but this theory cannot be proven at present. They are the best equipped but definitely not the strongest. I would argue that Turkey and Saudi Arabia are the strongest in the entire middle eastern region of the world.
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Theoretically they have the power to wipe out most of their neighbors.
I think you grossly over-estimating nuclear power and fallout results on a global scale. Nuclear weapons are deadly and powerful; this is true; no one questions this. But what many people do not foresee is the reaction of other countries when they are used. I believe other countries would be more afraid of those who would seek to use them. And once the weapon is used I believe that allies might become enemies. In short, I believe that if Israel used them against its neighbors then it would lose many powerful allies and turn them to enemies, such as Britain, France, Germany, and possibly even the U.S.
I believe that nuclear war should never be an option.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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SirDunco
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted January 25, 2006 03:16 PM |
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Theoretically they have the power to wipe out most of their neighbors.
Youre not reading the whole thing , as the rest of the sentence finishes...
[qoute]but that will hopefully not happen.
[/qoute]
Perhaps I should have said never. Ofcourse I hope that nuclear war will never happen but now, nuclear weapons are used mostly to add "weight" to your diplomatic actions. As far as it is suspected Israel has around a hundrer mounted Nuclear warheads, which is alot of firepower... But I think we got a bit off topic.
The problem in Israel is not war comming from outside. Right now the only country which could theoreticaly strike at Israel is Iran and perhaps Syria. But Syria is trying to rid it self of the international embargo's and Iran is trying to persuade everyone that they mean no trouble.
The only war is the internal war in Israel and in Civil War(although I'm not sure if you can call it that) nuclear weapons are useless.
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The_Gootch
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
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posted January 25, 2006 04:22 PM |
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I don't see any other country which returns lands they won in a bloody war.
My mother's sentiments exactly. In fact, I would not be surprised if most of the baby boomers felt this way. She feels that Israel is pretty justified in keeping the lands and why should you have to give back in peace what you've won in war? Funny..Ho Chi Minh asked that same question.
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Well, according to international law, war is not a legitimate way of expanding one's borders.
Don't get me started on you namby pamby euros. What pressure have Europeans brought upon Israel to show their collective displeasure at Israel's belligerence besides saying bad things about jews while shopping for jewelry?
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But feminism and nazism is the same
QFT. This is the best line of the year.
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Terrorism is wrong, but what is worse when it is done by an outlawed group or by an Army.
And some things never change. Grats SirDunco, your powers of political perception are still <deleted for extreme profanity, play nice>.
The Israeli and the Palestinian issue is so far beyond who is right and who is wrong. Both are worse than they advertise and neither can successfully claim to be victims.
Muslims should be embarrassed at how much of a double standard they have. Muslims die every day in India at the hands of Hindus but do you see chanting in the streets by young men holding AKs over that?
Nope. But they sure allow themselves to get worked up when a jew kills a muslim. Corrupt governments exploit their citizenry's ignorance to shield their own disgusting actions. Couple that with the fact that arab civilation has REGRESSED in the last century and is now considereed primitive and savage by western standards, yeah...we're pretty revolted.
By the same token Israel has practiced ethnic cleansing. Yeah I said it. I said it years ago and I'm repeating it. Furthermore, I am consistently irritated by the pro-Israel lobby here in the USA. What is in Israel's best interest is not in our best interest.
Maybe someday my fellow Americans will wake up and realize how despicable the Israelis are. Nah. Any crtique of Israel and you get labelled as being a nazi, facist, anti-semitic, or just flat out sued by the ADL.
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