|
|
gomaki
Shaper of Lore
Community Manager, Limbic Ent.
|
posted November 19, 2015 04:49 PM |
|
|
So far some good suggestions regarding the skill wheel. It's on my list for things to change for future support patches.
My thinking is that it is possible to change the core of the current skill wheel by doing things like, opening up more skills (all of them with rules like JJ has stated for example) I like that Idea, but visually I would have to see how it's handled. Remember ideas arn't just about the code, we need to think about how the GUI will look, then what sort of functionality we need to go with it. But it's more realistic suggestion than saying 'just scrap the entire thing and do it again'
Editor improvements are also in my scope and i'm slowly getting good feedback from people who are using it. I had a discussion today and unfortunately it's simply not possible to put the RMG into the game, which I, and many others agree would be a good idea. But the memory consumption and hardware requirements for such a thing would increase DRAMATICALLY. It's not that it takes a while to even RMG a map, it's the light cooking process. It all becomes a bit technical at some point but that wont be in this game for sure. However there are some other cool ideas we have regarding RMG and the editor in general that will improve it quite a lot.
I said it earlier a couple of pages back, balancing is very much something that will start being looked at now so any suggestions there are always welcome and we can bounce around ideas and I will share the feedback I get from designers and see what there response is and go from there.
|
|
OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 04:52 PM |
|
|
Why now? Why are you looking at balancing now, months after release?
____________
The giant has awakened
You drink my blood and drown
Wrath and raving I will not stop
You'll never take me down
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 04:55 PM |
|
|
Something to also consider changing are the wheel's lifeless colours  Shades of brown and grey skills? I mean compare it to this!
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Bitula
Known Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 04:56 PM |
|
|
JollyJoker said:
Ah, sure H7 invented the RP element for Heroes games.
I think, you don't really know what this is all about.
H5 was not the sort where you create BIO for a Hero. They have their own BIO. It’s I guess the same in H7. And I can compare only against H5. And from this point of view sure, H7 has much more RP elements: since it does not allow that much deviation from a role, like H5 did and it has eg.: classes. Which I think is a positive change.
|
|
Sligneris
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 05:01 PM |
|
|
OmegaDestroyer said:
Why now? Why are you looking at balancing now, months after release?
Because no one can change the past.
|
|
Brukernavn
Hero of Order
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 05:05 PM |
|
|
Bitula said:
And I can compare only against H5. And from this point of view sure, H7 has much more RP elements: since it does not allow that much deviation from a role, like H5 did and it has eg.: classes.
Less choices = more replayability
|
|
natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 05:06 PM |
|
Edited by natalka at 17:10, 19 Nov 2015.
|
@ gomaki
Kengi -- Stronghold
Class: Earth Shaper (magic defensive)
Specialization: [Chef] Friendly creatures in the hero's army regenerate 10 Health at the end of each combat round. Friendly creatures in the hero's army get +5 Morale at the beginning of a combat.
Stronghold is the easiest faction to play with. Why put this special to it. I suggest putting to Academy - Ajit. A little problem with the regeneration on the constructs but gameplay wise it will be better. Academy might heroes have trouble creeping and with this hero it would really make a difference hence make an interesting hero.
to Kengi give Jenova`s specialization - 350 gold per day. Orcs have problems with money so it would be cool to have one such hero.
Believe me, I like the specialization , its originality and the theme but it would be a waste on that faction.
|
|
Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 05:09 PM |
|
|
Sorry but maybe the skillwheel problem wouldn't have been that bad if you didn't wait for April 2015 to tell us about it thus putting us in front of a done deal. I say way to go working with the community, now you are very present here and while your efforts may be commendable at this stage I cannot not sense the bad will from the designers on the matter.
Although since you like to take h5 vanilla and TotE comparison you should notice there HAS been some consequent reworking of it in that lapse of time.
But whatever, do as you will and don't be surprised by the outcome.
____________
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 05:21 PM |
|
|
Black Hole Entertainment all over again,
let's force in our terrible reinventions of the wheel (literally), pay lip service to everyone who objects, listen to nobody, have our hair turn white when the numbers come in, and then finally scramble to fix the damage after it's already been done lol
____________
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 05:54 PM |
|
|
Getting things right the first time costs less in the long run.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Bitula
Known Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 06:01 PM |
|
|
Brukernavn said:
Bitula said:
And I can compare only against H5. And from this point of view sure, H7 has much more RP elements: since it does not allow that much deviation from a role, like H5 did and it has eg.: classes.
Less choices = more replayability
No, tactically it is the other way around, but a balance must be found between replay-ability and RP instead of removing all RP elements. I like both. And there is no fundamental issue with replay-ability in the current system. Just needs improvements. Some more dimensions.
|
|
The_green_drag
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 06:02 PM |
|
|
Ideas for balance...in the future.
- create interesting and diverse factions BEFORE making faction skills. All Ubi heroes games are always relying on faction skills to differentiate the way factions play. H7 is no different but we can't go back now. Only necropolis truely stands out with these 6.
Ideas for balancing h7...
1. To make things more interesting, i suggest moving one or two faction elite shooters to the top elite spot. My #1 choice would be academy or slyvan but not both. Because both have champion shooters and it gives a faction with more emphasis on ranged combat. I also think an archery skill would be a nice if this was to happen.
2. Branching off of the above, wyverns would have been better in the top elite spot. Basilisk riders are so similar to cavaliers it's not even funny. If you can't already tell, I hate patterns in faction line ups. Elite shooters in the same spot on each faction, nearly every top elite and top core being a melee walker...it's boring.
3. Make a champions with different growth and costs  make them unique sword masters should have been a 1 tile unit with more growth and less power. I'd say the same about grim riders.
4. Stop giving movement bonuses to creatures within faction skills. We have artifacts and spells for that. I see it as a problem because nearly every unit has an average speed of 5-6. It's boring. Why do golems move as far as an Orc?
5. Offense and defense skill should have % increases to scale into the late game and give more emphasis on higher tier creatures.
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 06:09 PM |
|
|
natalka said:
Hall of heroes
I think there is a need of total redesign of the philosophy of it. Heroes (MMH) is a game of multiple heroes. I think even new players should play with at least 3 heroes and learn some basic chaining of troops. That`s where all the magic is.. I don`t know. In previous versions (h3 & h5) we had one native hero and one non-native hero from certain factions. If you were lucky you could get 2 native heroes( 5% chance or less).
Issue 1) We have expensive heroes who can`t be bought day 1. This should be doable on any difficulty.(normal, hard,heroic)
issue 2) we can buy more than 2 heroes with army
On many maps it will be smarter to NOT build completely for one day but buy a hero with army in the first week(s). I don`t know if that is the type of gameplay we all want? I think when the tavern became hall of heroes in MMH6 it totally lost sense. MMH6`s one was even more horrendous!
Agreed on both accounts. One native and one non native hero in the tavern always worked for me and no matter your strategy, you will always need a second hero for the extra troops, exploration, picking or flagging stuff. Makes the game more exciting.
I like how H7 adds more non native heroes but like in the old games, I would prefer that after a couple of heroes you don't get further army. It's just cheesy and the armies really add up. The old team had long recognized and tackled gameplay traps like this, there is more insight in their workings than meets the eye.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Bitula
Known Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 06:33 PM |
|
|
Sligneris said:
OmegaDestroyer said:
Why now? Why are you looking at balancing now, months after release?
Because no one can change the past.
Exactly! Some simply fail to understand that it is not the past which needs to be fixed, but the game. This is not a moral issue. Seriously, I find this attitude of “you didn’t listen to us in the past, so now by definition this game cannot be good whatever you do in the future” childish.
|
|
natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 06:43 PM |
|
|
Quote:
The old team had long recognized and tackled gameplay traps like this, there is more insight in their workings than meets the eye.
I really love that part
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 06:57 PM |
|
|
Bitula said:
Exactly! Some simply fail to understand that it is not the past which needs to be fixed, but the game. This is not a moral issue. Seriously, I find this attitude of “you didn’t listen to us in the past, so now by definition this game cannot be good whatever you do in the future” childish.
can you identify anyone who you think is expressing that particular attitude? lol
____________
|
|
Bitula
Known Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 07:56 PM |
|
Edited by Bitula at 19:57, 19 Nov 2015.
|
verriker said:
Bitula said:
Exactly! Some simply fail to understand that it is not the past which needs to be fixed, but the game. This is not a moral issue. Seriously, I find this attitude of “you didn’t listen to us in the past, so now by definition this game cannot be good whatever you do in the future” childish.
can you identify anyone who you think is expressing that particular attitude? lol
Eg.: You? 
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 08:22 PM |
|
|
Bitula said:
Eg.: You?
well your description doesn't correspond to my attitude, so, nope, lol
____________
|
|
Karanshade
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 08:28 PM |
|
|
verriker said:
Bitula said:
Eg.: You?
well your description doesn't correspond to my attitude, so, nope, lol
Could have fooled me
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted November 19, 2015 08:35 PM |
|
|
Karanshade said:
Could have fooled me
oh I'm sure I could have, lol
I see a lot of shadow-boxing going on at the various forums in defence of this product, it's just bad argumentation to put words in people's mouths and assume far too much of their motives lol
____________
|
|
|
|
This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
