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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted January 27, 2005 02:49 AM |
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What a suprise.
really.. you questionize one moderator and his/her methods, and the very same moderator will end up giving you a penalty. Or enforce that a penalty will be given. And then you once again got the united front.
Its time like these.. that i would like to share the knowledge i got about things such as the "united modfront" here. But i wont. Ive never revealed information ive gotten in private so far. And i wont do it now either. just sickens me how mod politcal this has became. Atleast in the old days you knew how the mods felt because they made it known. Bad move revealing it in public? yes.. but atleast they stood up for it.
Now.. im just fed up with this, i dont have the energy to even questionize every single penalty i get because every time i say a word that basically every other member can say.. i get a penalty for it.
the guy has over 100 posts, two of em being red stared. new member? lol
Point is it doesnt matter what i say or who i say it too. If they wanna see a penalty i will recieve one. Thats the good thing being in a leading position, because you can always make the rules suit your actions when they leave space for interpetion. But it is in cases like this, when its abused and inconsistant that it becomes dangerous and bad.
As for you pan.. what can i say?
Since you became a moderator ive always seen you as the voice of reason and diplomacy.
Now youre janus. Two faced.
And by that im just not refering to the penalty and the reasoning back and forward we have had in private.
no.
Im more refering to a previous post in this thread where it seems you have spoken things you never ever would say judging on the discussions we have had.
Basically you have told him/her one truth, and me a complete other.
Being diplomatic is one thing.. trust me wether its hard to believe i do know much about it. But one thing ive learned about being diplomatic, is always be telling the truth. Because you dont wanna end up in a position where both your "truths" are getting up to the surface. That would hurt your credability alot. Especially when those "truths" happens to be opposites.
As for the post in question i see no point in naming it, pan knows which one. That im sure about.
Getting this far, im wondering about two things:
1) why i keep writing this post as im sure it will find a "political" reason to be deleted anyway.
2) why i even bother writing it in the first place.
2nd i did came up with an answer on, because it concerns a person i used to call a friend.
touché though. Being here at HC, ive always intentionally focused more on my joking/tossing side. One reason for that is that i wouldnt wanna end up with alot of wannabe friends. Im popular.. i can got those IRL without a problem. Funny thing is as things worked out i found myself in a position where i couldnt shut up.. that way i revealed more of myself i guess. Members where getting pissed on here if they werent in a particular cliché of people. That i didnt like.. so i started to critize/questionize it.. and ive done it until this day when i think something is wrong. Problem with that was that members started to support me, but still to try not to end up in a postion where i get lots of "friends" here i intentionally didnt talk alot by IM:s nor adding many members to my MSN. Still.. this way ive gotten to learn many people by the way they post and show pieces of their personality about that.
And many of em seem like really good people... you got Ivo. You got bort, khayman, motorschaafted, hamsi&mad... you got the juve supporter... heck even Val after talking to him on MSN. Conan is another one im starting to like. Svarog if you take away his statue fetisch and so on.. those i would like having a beer with if the oppurtunity came up. On this list i also had pandora.
She had my full confidence and trust, now ive seen signs as lightly refered to above that this hardly seem to be the case. Now there are many things i wonder about when its about pandora and doublestandards, things i cant go into more detail on though as they would once again violate personal private conversations. On the other hand, knowing me to keep these private things might just be the thing, the reason for not giving me the sack as if all my information about this place came out HC would become a total mess.
But these moves pan.. was a touché because i could never see it coming from you.
Some of you think i exhaggerate now, and well.. from a "normal" perspective maybe i am. But one thing that means most to me is honesty. Without honesty you dont have anything IMO.
And obviously me and pandora doesnt have this honesty any more.
Talking about politics, this is without doubt the most stupid decision i could have made. I just lost my most HC influental friend, but if thats the prize to pay to keep my dignity ill gladly pay it.
At first.. this was going to be my retirement post.
Learning that a person i did trust (those doesnt come by often) have different faces out.. and different truths depending on who you talk too took me by complete suprise. And then as the spark giving a penalty like this knowing what she has said before...
And then off course you have me banging my head towards the wall trying to get a new system here which will improve things hopefully... only to get told that that isnt the way to bang my head towards the wall and its better to do it as it always has been done.. and then a little mouse jumps out from a mousehole in the wall telling me that the other way is better and the little mouse can get paid with a piece of cheese. And then when i tell the mouse that he could just aswell move into the other persons clothing the wall turns into a concrete one.
basically.. i lost faith and got shown what in IMO is a serious lack of ambition.
then i thought, if i am to give up on this place i refuse to do it in a manner like this. Unless this post leads me into getting the boot off course.
If not.. i will just have to find a way to smash this concrete wall with me head. And we´ll see what happens after that.
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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted January 27, 2005 04:00 AM |
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couldnt have anticipated a more predictable reply even if i had tried to.
Off course it will seem to you as im angry because we were friends, that is the message you will want to send out right now. Pretending to have absolutely no idea of what im talking about and wanna make it sounds like i did this because of some bitterness?
its just so low.
And then we have the friends issue.. which just happen to give you another perfect excuse. Because as much as you blame it for not being able to do right, you can turn the tables.. and say that whatever you want is right because you can always excuse it away with that.. no matter what you pick its you who has the tough position. Which means, you do what you want and then people will just have to believe you.. since you being in that "tough position" so you had to pick one.
Once again.. you have the liberty of choosing the true meaning of something. just like the CoC, because you can always motivate it with it being against the rules.. since the rules are so open it leaves plenty of room for perceieving the text how you want.
And once again.. its you who gets to make the call. With your back covered blaming tough positions and deciding how something should be percieved.
And it keeps getting better.. i tell you i dont want anymore IM:s from you and that i haved removed you from MSN.. you suggest in public that i use IM:s or public.. but you know me so you know i wont use the public space to publish personal conversations.
So once again you got it covered.
But if you are so eager to have me prove these doublestandards.. these twoway truths..this janus BS that you claim to have no idea about say so and i will gladly smash the place filled with MSN logs and contradictions here in posts etc.
I for one value personal conversations, but when someone is even trying to take advantage of that it has IMO gotten to far.
i wont publish em for my own winning like that as you know i concider it distasteful, but if you insist on me making those logs public?
And to finish it off.. the diplomatic touch, the cry end.
The "i dont think anyone should call anyone elses posts worthless"...
well...
I said i dont care about em, thats not saying they are worthless.. its saying opinions based on what others want to hear doesnt matter to me. But obviously they do matter to you pandora, that doesnt make them worthless.
But truth to be told, i personally prefer doing it this way and not saying how much i love his writing to turn my back and say that his posts are just annoying and creepy.
But then.. that might just be me out of the two of us as things seem.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted January 27, 2005 04:27 AM |
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Dejavu ROmana, dont this bring back some memories.
The feeding of replies & dispair is a hunger for some people & the best way to solve that kind of problem is to just not bother 
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Dreaming of a Better World
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pandora
Honorable
Legendary Hero
The Chosen One
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posted January 27, 2005 04:33 AM |
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I agree. I'll admit that I'm sad about it all - but obviously Stiven has his reasons for feeling upset, and I won't question it or drag any members into an ugly debate.
Stiven, when I said speak here or in private I did not mean to have any past private conversations brought here - I have no such logs and never felt it neccessary to keep them.
I think that obviously personal feelings exist here - but they really don't have a place here in this thread.
The topic is improving the Tavern, Sir_Stiven has made a thread with that as an effort.
Do any other members have any input/ ideas as to what we can do?
edit: I deleted my previous responses when I realized what Sir Stiven was speaking about. While I think its a matter we could have discussed and he might have felt differently, I respect and understand his decisions just the same. Its unrelated to the matter of the penalty. Sorry to have dragged anyone into a personal matter between him and myself.
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"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted January 27, 2005 06:26 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 27 Jan 2005
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The Root Of All Evil
I think the root of the problem here is obviously Dingo. At some point, he has cleverly enabled(or perhaps we've allowed) his alter ego to interfere with our affairs for the last time. I can't believe we've all fallen for the very same sinister plot once again. We must all be plebes to so easily fall for his maniacal schemes the way we do. Time and again, his genius is proven everytime we fight amongst ourselves. If the Tavern is to see the light of day when, we the members, live in perfect harmony and peaceful tranquility we must take action. Someone of high Community rank/status needs to tell him (or his mad-scientist-other alter ego self) to Chill Out.
Join me and together we can end this madness!
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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RedSoxFan3
Admirable
Legendary Hero
Fan of Red Sox
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posted January 27, 2005 07:41 AM |
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All I can say about all this quarrelling is...
Foobums.
This is absolutely ridiculous. There's nothing to argue about. Nothing. Sir Stiven why must you make everything a big stink? I swear you are the type of person who can be in a great mood for months and then all of a sudden snap and start bashing everything.
Clearly there are issues going on here that have nothing to do with HC. You are upset about something and taking it out here. So if you want to blame Pandora for being a stickler on the rules, then that's your problem.
Honestly Stiven. What motive or personal agenda would Pandora have to penalize you?
I certainly never had one, yet you accused me. You need to stop being in something called DENIAL!!!! GET OVER YOURSELF!!!!
When you do that, you will be a hell of a lot happier. It doesn't matter who the moderator is. If they give you a penalty, they are on a mission to get you kicked out. I think it's clear that Hexa hated you, but the new mods here have been your friends. Previously when the new mods, including myself, we never had to be involved in how you put down other members. As a moderator, you have to deal with everything, so I really didn't see all the problems you were causing, until it was my job to make sure there weren't any problems.
My point is that you put down others and you give excuses of righteousness to yourself, so you don't have to feel bad about it and then you try to pawn off the excuses onto other people. There's a big difference between being destructive with your criticism and being constructive. You just don't get that.
You think that people should be able to take any criticism and if they can't take it then they are in denial.
Well let me tell you that's not the case. This is the way it is. If you can't take it then you are in denial.
Now I know you will scream that I am contradicting myself, well let's take a look at the facts. New members have posted on numerous occasions of their dislike for you, because you put them down. Soccerfeva no longer comes here because you among others harassed him. Other members like Cat were supportive of him. I can only guess one of the reasons she no longer comes here, is because of her disgust of how so many of the members of HC treated each other. But I can't use that as fact. The point is that you have been associated with being a noob killer for quite sometime. How many times have you made a post that tells a noob that he has no clue what he's talking about, because he's a stupid noob. So I award you with this.
Enjoy your award.
Now let's take a look at reality. I'll use Soccerfeva as an example. He had really improved his posting before he left. Had people not harassed him, he'd have stayed. We will never know if he would have been a great poster or not.
Finally I'll say this. It may be a cliche, but it's true. You get more bees with honey than vinegar. So basically if we want to get people to come here, the place has to be more enjoyable. You Sir_Stiven are not helping. That penalty is a step in the direction that I would like to take.
You know that if I disagreed with a penalty, I would voice it immediately. I've supported you in the past, but seriously this happens too often to support you anymore. Even if your heart is in the right place, which I'm not questioning, you can still do harm.
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Go Red Sox!
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Lord_Woock
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Daddy Cool with a $90 smile
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posted January 27, 2005 12:35 PM |
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First visit to HC of the day, and imagine what I felt when I saw not one, but two potentially awesome threads here in Tavern. Drop the who's guilty talk and let's make sure both of them are lotsa fun indeed.
*throws thankyou cards at Stiven and RSF*
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Yolk and God bless.
---
My buddy's doing a webcomic and would certainly appreciate it if you checked it out!
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Shiva
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted January 27, 2005 01:11 PM |
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Everything I have said previously stems from this:
There is actually nothing wrong with the Tavern.
I have personally participated in a few interesting
discussions there in the past few months, and read
others that were excellent but didn't provoke a
response.
Not every thread is going to appeal to everyone, but
as long as people choose to tell their story, it will
be an interesting place.
A positive action is always to start a thread with a
topic that appeals to you, rather than bashing what
is there. That kind of action will always lead to
destructive posting.
So I appreciate those that started new threads today.
Thats the way to go. And if I don't participate in them
don't think anything of it. 
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted January 27, 2005 04:17 PM |
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You like talking alot of smack huh Shiva.
You dont know when to shut up.
Yea we know what your talking about & we know your trying to start more smack but I would suggest you shut it so there wont be anymore trouble.
You dont even have a reason to say any of this anyways.
Yea I dont agree with Stivens replies towards Pandora I think people in anger forget too look at the big picture or even care to know why.
They think thier too good to even want to know why when thier ego is way up & they think thier the only people in the right & all of us is in the wrong.
Thats Stiven behavior for ya & this reminds me exactly like the ROmana incident so I am glad Pandora dropped it unlike Romana who wouldnt till yrs later.
You basically dropped a friendship & went all out to talk your smack for a -QP, nothing else.
That to me is crap.
Yall need to talk about it & quit being so arrogant.
Now with Shiva, he (with the female myth name) Deserved whatever came to him, he came in only because he dont like Stiven & started all this crap & knew he get flamed for it & caused the -QP.
We all get the clue Shiva, you dont like Stiven because hes annoying but dont give you no right to start this.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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pandora
Honorable
Legendary Hero
The Chosen One
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posted January 27, 2005 05:01 PM |
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oi! *smacks head*
Aculias, no no no!! Don't do it man! Please no flames.
I don't understand your offense at Shiva's last post. It seemed to me to be an attempt to bury any hatchets that were lying about and move on - so lets do just that.
I appreciate that people will have emotional reactions to situations once in a while, but letting that emotion rule you is not going to help. On my end, I have told Stiven that I see now what he is talking about - and I would be willing to talk with him about it - but he doesn't wish that - so okay, that's the end of the story. I'm not going to let any personal feelings interefere with the forum or the goal of improving it.
The topic that we have focused on is improving the forum and I would like to remain zeroes in on that.
One good start would be not to attack each other, but to figure out how to work together. I feel that there have already been several attempts at this in the last 24 hours, so lets put our energy into that 
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"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."
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Lich
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 27, 2005 05:05 PM |
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LOL... Look whos' talking about arrogancy and the time "when to shut up"... Don't advice people do stuff first not doing same thing youtself, mister...
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted January 27, 2005 05:08 PM |
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I really wonder why u defend Stefan in such an intensive way Manuel. I think he can do that himself very well...if he likes..
And i see nothing bad in getting a penalty when breaking the CoC. Earth will still spinning around, and Stefan still will make many positive posts in the future as well, and getting some +qp for them also.
But to blame a Mod for doing his/her job is just lame. Friendship doesn´t count in that situation in my eyes. And don´t tell me Stefan hasn´t been warned enough in former times about exact this behaviour...
As most of us accept a +qp when earning one, we also should accept a -qp when "earning" one. And i´m really sure, Stefan knows he "earned" this penalty well enough.
Sometimes i really think he tries to see how far he has to go to "earn" a -qp....but that´s perhaps just my subjective point of view...could be wrong also..
....nevermind...
Accept the facts and go on...all the discussions about those penalties lead to nothing but to more quarrel...and that´s not worth it..
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted January 27, 2005 05:37 PM |
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You know me Angelo I speak my mind on how i feel & yea I agree on -QP for Stiven & Pandora but not with Shiva, he deserves what he got but thats just me personally.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Shiva
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted January 27, 2005 05:39 PM |
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Not much to respond to in what Aculias said except:
Shiva is actually the Hindu God of destruction..Heroes
got it wrong.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted January 27, 2005 05:45 PM |
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I know what SHiva is thank you & I know what kind of person you are so it would be best to just leave it Shiva because you think you are better & know more then us.
Your attitude sucks.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Shiva
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted January 27, 2005 05:50 PM |
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Even less to respond to in that
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted January 27, 2005 05:54 PM |
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You dont have to, your just was out of our league.
Your just way too cool for us.
Who cares.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Lich
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 27, 2005 05:57 PM |
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Shiva, you can just stop replying to mister's replies since he won't stop posting back. It's from my personal experience, beleave me...
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pandora
Honorable
Legendary Hero
The Chosen One
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posted January 27, 2005 05:57 PM |
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When I think of Shiva I think of FinalFantasy games
I've played them all so many times that i've come to believe that Shiva is real, and if I'm ever in trouble Shiva will show up, freeze my enemies and then snap her fingers to turn em to icy shards!
Okay, I don't really believe that - just trying to add a little levity to the tension that just keeps coming up.
I had another thread Idea sparked by the PersonalPages. I was thinking what we could do is write a mock biography for each other - and then have things rated. Not so much a biography, but more a short story with a humourous theme.
In example one could write a story about a typical day in the life of Svarog, and in that include his relationships and interactions with statues that he meets along the way
It would be important to keep these things in the spirit of good fun, nothing vulgar or insulting - but just little anecdotes about our fellow members based on bits of their personalities that we've seen come through in their posting.
Would anyone be interested in doing something like that? i think we could arrange a thread where mebers suggest ideas on what to write for each individual - and as well members can claim whose story they would like to wtite - that way we don't have 50 stories about say Asmodean.
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"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."
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TheRealDeal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Foobum* of Justice!
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posted January 27, 2005 10:07 PM |
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Quote:
nothing vulgar or insulting
I'm guessing this was the "Anti-Foobum"-Sticker
Edit: BTw, anima is the coolest Aeon
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*We all know the that Foobum is the class of all that is Cake.
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This thread is pages long: 
