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Sindbad
Famous Hero
The lost soul
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posted October 01, 2006 08:20 PM |
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Edited by Sindbad at 20:20, 01 Oct 2006.
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Thats what I expected right now! 
Sorry, I cant write a long list of my ideas now, because here its 8:20 pm and Im doing my homework! So bye for now, see ya tomorrow, Im going offline.
Besides thanks for making me happy again!!!
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Already gone...
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actionjack
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 01, 2006 08:27 PM |
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Quote:
Ok. Stop. everyone... list your ideas. Take what exists and come up with something that fits. right now we need 4 abilities for a bunch of units. And names of dwellings. And a racial skill and hero type. there pour ur ideas into those parts. but yes the nagas are a swamp town not a sea town, mayan/aztec architecture, blah blah.
action jack - why are u complaining? ur ideas got implemented!!!
Of couse I "complain". Be ask to take a idea off (namely the Marina town) is not to be taken lightly.
I don't have problem with the people, and I am sure they have in their heart whats best for the communities interest. I do question the approch of it all. Since the OP is start out as asking for community to propose their idea, not ideas that best fit your view.
I mean, it would seem each one already have a good basic idea of what a Naga town would be like, why not just post it out a build, and than have a disscussiong afterward, rather than rejecting or accepting ideas that best fit your "perfect" view. (unless the judging is done by Alc, or by more people, than I got no problem with)
That said... simply change the thread title to "Community Input on Swamp Naga Town" would sound more fitting.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted October 01, 2006 08:34 PM |
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Ok here's the lineup. We need 4 abilities for some of the creature below:
Level 1: Serpent Fly - Flyer
Upgrade: Coatl - Flyer, Weakening Bite (causes slow with each attack)
Similiar to the ones in HoMM3. An ability could be due here.
Level 2: Tracker - Shooter, Corrosive Shot(Decreases Armour over time)
Upgrade: Chameleon Sniper - Shooter, Corrosive Shot, Exact Aim(Halves Range Penalty), Camouflage (Turns invisible when moving to another square. doesnt work if its a move attack. will be revealed if an enemy unit moves next to it)
A lizardman. With a blow dart/spears. Would u like to see blow darts or spears...
Level 3: Temple Viper - First Strike
Upgrade: Temple Cobra - First Strike, Meditate(Gives up this turn, to increases stats for the next)
Imagine the Naga from HoMM3 with thick armor and a long halberd. It's a male naga though. An ability could be due here.
Level 4: Sentinel - Large, Enraged, Deathroll (Sentinal has X% chance to avoid attack by rolling to adjecent tiles)
Upgrade: Grand Sentinal - Large, Enraged, Deathroll, Petrifying Gaze
This is a lizardman riding on a croc (basilisk in upgrade)
Level 5: Gladiator - Large, Double Attack
Upgrade: Preatorian - Large, Double Attack, No Retaliation
Big male four armed naga with many swords. An ability is definately due here.
Level 6: Priestess - Shooter, Caster
Upgrade: High Priestess - Shooter, Caster
Female naga with snake for hair but no petrifying gaze. the upgrade definately needs an ability.
Level 7: Water Wyrm - Large, Flyer, Tidal Wave (Creates a giant wave the Damages all creatures in front of Water Wyrm (4 tiles wide ?)
Upgrade: Water Dragon - Large, Flyer, Tidal Wave, Divine Presence (+1 morale for all friendly creatures)
A picture is posted early on in the thread of what this creature should look like.
Ok my issue with the water wyrm is the name. Should it be changed to Blue or Azure Wyrm/Dragon or left as Water Wyrm/Dragon. Next is the tidal wave. How much area should it cover. And lastly should it be immune to cold based spells.
Your suggestions are most welcomed and appreciated.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted October 01, 2006 08:38 PM |
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Most insightful Action Jack. Perhaps we should change the topic name. Thanks for bringing it up. Hey I got a name for the town: Refuge. Why? Cuz haven, sanctuary, refuge all means the same thing. secondly nagas want to be left alone. a refuge in the swamp is fitting. because of the whole isolation thing. so there's my 10cents worth: REFUGE!!!!
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted October 01, 2006 08:39 PM |
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Quote:
Level 3: Temple Viper - First Strike
Upgrade: Temple Cobra - First Strike, Meditate(Gives up this turn, to increases stats for the next)
Imagine the Naga from HoMM3 with thick armor and a long halberd. It's a male naga though. An ability could be due here.
I think Polearms are overused already, it might be nicer to use a Mace instead ?
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted October 01, 2006 08:47 PM |
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Mace?? Only if it comes with a shield. But how are polearms overused? Let me see what units have em: peasant, cavalier, dark raider and if you count of shaman. Thats bout it. Mace wielders: bear rider of the dwarves, and our goblins. Alright then... I agree with mace.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted October 01, 2006 08:56 PM |
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Quote:
Mace?? Only if it comes with a shield. But how are polearms overused? Let me see what units have em: peasant, cavalier, dark raider and if you count of shaman. Thats bout it. Mace wielders: bear rider of the dwarves, and our goblins. Alright then... I agree with mace.
Our Goblins use knives and cleavers. Also we shouldn't make such quick decisions any more, that's what all the unsatisfied community caused.
Side note;
It seems strange to me, that this town gets far more attention then the Perfect Stronghold thread. Why is that and why is it that nobody complained about the obvious big-boys-club there, before the project was on the brink of being finished ?
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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yasmiel
Supreme Hero
Former Chessmaster
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posted October 01, 2006 08:57 PM |
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Not that my opinion will matter in the end but few of the things that are already "accepted as finished" dont look too good for me...
First of all, dart-sniper?... Ever tried to blow a dart over a long distance?... its not a long distance weapon and thus cannot be sniping one... darts are too light to be so accurate over whole battlefield..
Second,.. gladiator and praetorian... names sound ok on their own, but when used for same creature, they dont... no gladiator ever became a praetorian.... ..its still better than archon...
About some abilities now...
Frenzy (for gladiator/myrmidon/praetorian or whichever name)- After each succesfull melee attack, this unit gains cumulative +1 to initiative untill the end of battle...
Hiding (should put better name for ability, for chameos/lizardmen) - Whenever this unit uses wait or defend command, it gains 50% chances to evade attacks untill its next turn, similar to ethereal.
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actionjack
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 01, 2006 09:00 PM |
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Some persional opinions...
- Just feel Coatl is not a fitting name for a lv1 unit, as it is more divine in myth. I like Drgaon Fly, as it is very punny.
- on the Tracker.. I would maybe take the Corrosive Shot out of one (either tracker or sniper), and replace with another kind of shot of differnt effect (maybe like Stunt Shot). This split the two, making them having differt purpose (a bit like how Archer and Marksman are differnt)
- On the Temple Viper/Cobra. Hope they are not just big snake, but more of a naga form, with arms (the name sound a bit missleading on first look)
-Sentinal... seem strange with a death roll... as it has a rider.. and a Croc seem not easy to roll around with... Not sure it need a defensive move too.. maybe like a Chump (lower attacking creature's armor for few turns) would be good.
-On Gladiator, may be could add Slither (allow them to by pass creature or obsticles, like teleporation move) to make them more of a In-striker.
-For priestess, the petrifying gaze does sound very powerful.. maybe just change it where it is an active ablity, that it will stunt the target creature, but it is break of if the priestest or the creatre take damage, or if the priestess move and take other action. Also make it melee (1 sq) range.
-I am not a dragon lover, and not sure like to see another dragon (since more of the swamp dragon are not all that powerful), but I do like Azure name better. And if it is more Leviathan-like than dragon shape, that I would be fine with it. But I like Tidal Wave. Maybe also Ring of Water Blast? (like fire shield, damage all around when attack)
So far it seems that it will play out much like the Dungeon (dark elf) faction with its creature line up. Guess have to see what Hero's ablity might be to tell if it could be more unique or not.
So far, seem like there most of the mid-level creatures are land bound melee attacker. Need some way to cover their advance.
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Oh, and I just read it later... but I like yasmiel's idea too, in perticular the Hiding ablity.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted October 01, 2006 09:25 PM |
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Hahahaha... That's right. Our goblins are using cleavers. I totally forgot because of that whole mace vs. shooter goblin thing way back then. War-Overlord and I were fighting over it. Well I think with the whole Stronghold getting sent to Nival must have gotten ppl all excited over this town. Cant say I blame em. Hey what about the name Refuge?
I agree with you on the dart sniper yasmiel. the name has to go. Got a suggestion? I would like them to have spears. Or even spit corrosive acid. That would be cool, wouldn't it? Spitting lizards? I suggested gladiator cuz we obviously cant use myrmidon. archon was a longshot but yeah a stupid name. I love Frenzy. Though the name has to change cuz theres a spell with the same name. With hiding, I would rather go with my idea cuz i hate it when u have to move ur shooter so u can use ur ranged damage and then the enemy just attacks you again at melee and made ur whole moving turn a waste. this way u could turn invisible and run, the enemy wont know where u are unless it gets a lucky guess and stands next to you. and then u can shoot again next turn. i wouldnt want to copy incorporeal cuz i think its a fantastic ability which should only be owned by the ghost.
The DnD coatl is exactly what we are using... a winged snake. i despise using the name dragon too often. I like corrosive shot. But thats just me. Temple vipers are nagas. unless u want it to be templar viper. but temple viper sounds cooler. so long as the dwelling is not viper temple. hahaha. Yeah the sentinel and the rider was a problem i brought up. war-overlord and i discussed how we could get around it. the discussion is somewhere on page 4 i think. let me know what u think? Death Roll is unique. I would rather it stayed. Slither... I don't know. Perhaps u cud explain more.
Petrifying gaze - only usable as a melee ability. its a 15% chance to stun enemy. enemy cannot move for certain amount of rounds depending on the number of priestess available. the "petrified" stack gains a certain amount of defense from having the stone skin. but they cannot move or attack. if attacked they dont retaliate. only one stack can be stoned at one time. thats my idea. another issue that needs debating.
Its more leviathan than dragon shaped. I wouldnt want to see another green/black dragon-esque creature walking around. No this dragon has no legs. looks like a giant flying snake with dragon head and wings and tail. it stays in the water most of the time hence no need for legs. I would like to name it Azure wyrm as well.
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yasmiel
Supreme Hero
Former Chessmaster
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posted October 01, 2006 09:31 PM |
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Edited by yasmiel at 21:33, 01 Oct 2006.
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I am using a mod that resets all spell names to their original names ( i despise ubi for changing them, even the game mechanics use old names as identifiers when dealing with spells, so i dont have frenzy in my list... for what spell is that name used? berserk spell?
I like the spitting idea, but it should have limited range then, maybe 3 or 4 squares .. currently we dont have short range archer so that could be a good change...
Note that darts sound good as well, both weapons work for me.. maybe even bumerang with could do  ... JK
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actionjack
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 01, 2006 09:37 PM |
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What about the name "Temple", if going with a mayan/inca theme with Priestess as the top class in the social order.
"Ruin" might be doable too, if its an old old race.
Slither is where you could walk pass by a creature (friendly or ally) or not be block by them. (assuming there are enough space at the end of your movement) This allow them to move more freely, and attack those in the back better.
for level 7... why not just name it Azure Wyrm and Leviathan?
(or Leviathan and Ancient Leviathan)
Its a name much like Behemoth, with biblical orgin.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted October 01, 2006 10:43 PM |
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Temple would be perfect as a building for the priestess but not as a town name because the whole town is not built like a temple. Heres a rough picture of what it would look like:
Imagine the Dungeon town but turn it upside down. The bottom structures are all submerged under water. The city hall, town hall, special structures, mage guild will all be under water. Then u rise and break the waters surface. this is where the blacksmith, marketplace, fort/castle will all be located. The Tear of Asha special will be half underwater half above. The dwellings for the lizardmen and basilisk will be above. The priestess temple will join with the viper/cobra temple quarters. The priestess will be below water and their viper/cobra guard above to protect them. the water/azure dragons will be underwater of course. The serpent flies will make their nests in the large mangrove trees. It's all mayan architecture as far as the naga dwellings, castles, fort, mage guild, special structures are concerned and everything else will look something like the fortress from Homm3. But the cool part is if u use the camera u can actually dive underwater and vice versa. thats what the swamp town would look like. having said that both ruins and temple wouldnt exactly fit this town's description. which is why i suggested refuge.
PS- Berserk is an ability of the dwarven berserker. I rather darts than boomerang.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted October 01, 2006 10:45 PM |
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As much as it pains me to say this, I'm going to have to give this thread out of hands. My study will swallow up most of my time for the next three weeks and seeing the rapid movement this thread is making I won't be able to keep up with it. I regret it if my inexperience in leading such a thread has hurt anybody in any way. I apologise for this. I might join the development when I have time again, as far as such is wanted and nesecary. I will be available for advice via HC messenger, but it might take a few days for me to respond. I hope you have fun with this development. Try to remember this would-be creator with fondness.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted October 02, 2006 11:57 AM |
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Dang, you people just got started and WarOverlord quits. Ok, I'm in. I'll try to replace him as much as I can. I just need to read all your stuff and I'll be able to help around tomorrow.
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Sindbad
Famous Hero
The lost soul
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posted October 02, 2006 02:49 PM |
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Bye war-overlord! You are already in oblivion...
And about me, I quit in this thread too. I stay with Alcs town. If you want to know about my vision of the town, its actually improved Alcs town. Besides, can anyone tell me how can I turn off the email notification to not receive any more posts from here???
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Already gone...
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted October 02, 2006 10:41 PM |
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I know you all “quit” but I also know you’ll still read this topic for a while.
So read this. That goes for everyone who participated or wanted to participate.
First of all, I see everyone is suddenly fighting between themselves and abandoning this project. That HAS TO CHANGE. We made the Perfect Stronghold thanks to our unity and mutual help. Now I see the PS team degenerated and became more conservative, and some advisors are becoming untolerant (Town name must be Conservatory? We aren’t going nowhere with that kind of fascist attitude).
What we have to do is just hear out everyone’s proposals and COMMENT THEM.
SBlister, when you first rolled in to the PS topic you gave a pretty crappy creature lineup but I gave you support and you became one of the most creative members of PS. Same with WarOverlord and some of his ideas. I also suggested crappy stuff sometimes but I still got support. That’s what kept us alive.
BTW, I think Sindbad has some ok ideas, although he’s kinda melodramatic.
Anyway, when I saw all that “I’m not playing with you anymore” stuff I actually stopped reading the thread. Actionjack is right, a handful of people controls everything. What we need to do is start over.
So, if everyone (yes, EVERYONE) would please STOP BEING CHILDISH snowS and return to the team, we’ll be able to make a kickass town. Otherwise, we can just abandon this project right away.
Let me know.
Meanwhile, I have a few advices.
How about Pantheon for the town name? If not Bastion would be cool.
BTW correct me if I’m wrong, but check this out:
-The Naga use katanas
-They come from Indian mythology
-There is no far-east based faction in the game for now
Rings a bell? Never mind, if you people still want nagas in a swamp, that’s ok. Anyway, of all the suggested lineups I like this one the most:
1 Serpent Fly (Flyer) - Coatl (Flyer, Weakenning Bite(cast weakness on attack(in honor of the Dragon Flies of HoMM 3)))
2 Tracker(Shooter, Corrosive Shot(Decreases Armour over time)) - Sniper (Shooter, Corrosive Shot, Exact Aim(Halves Range Penalty))
3 Templar Viper (First Strike) - Templar Cobra (First Strike, Meditate(Gives up this turn, to double stats for the next))
4 Sentinel (Large, Enraged, Deathroll(Sentinal has X% chance to avoid attack by rolling to adjecent tiles)) - Grand Sentinal (Large, Enraged, Deathroll, Petrifying Gaze)
5 Gladiator (Large, Double Attack) - Preatorian (Large, Double Attack, No Retaliation)
6 Priestess (Shooter, Caster) - High Priestess (Shooter, Caster, Geyser(Similar to SBlister's wrath, but with a geyser))
7 Water Wyrm (Large, Flyer, Tidal Wave(Creates a giant wave the Damages all creatures in front of Water Wyrm(4 tiles wide ?)))- Water Dragon (Large, Flyer, Tidal Wave, Divine Presence)
However, I’d change the Sniper to Sharpshooter, in honour of the coolest unit ever, cruelly forgotten by the whips of time (whoa I sound like bloody Shakespeare).
I don’t like having three walking melee fighters in a row (Templar, Sentinel, Gladiator). It would be best if we avoid the gladiators. Something like:
Lvl 1 – OK
Lvl 2 – OK, though I’d change the Sniper if I had any better ideas
Lvl 3 – Sentinel - Warden
Lvl 4 – Templar – Praetorian
Lvl 5 – Turtle knight – Tortoise knight (or something like that; I kinda like turtles)
Lvl 6 – Good unit, lousy name
Lvl 7 - Wyrm – Leviathan? I think there’s enough dragons already
I don’t know, that’s just advices, as I said. If this topic gets back to the right way I’ll be more helpful
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LordTitan
Famous Hero
Hit Dice: 76d12+608 HP
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posted October 03, 2006 12:50 AM |
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Minor Details
Quote:
Level 7: Water Wyrm - Large, Flyer, Tidal Wave (Creates a giant wave that Damages all creatures in front of Water Wyrm (4 tiles wide ?)
Upgrade: Water Dragon - Large, Flyer, Tidal Wave, Divine Presence (+1 morale for all friendly creatures)
A picture is posted early on in the thread of what this creature should look like.
I've underlines a bunch o' stuff that (to me anyways) is a bit odd.
A) In general, A Wyrm is a really old, and powerful dragon, while a dragon is the adult version of the wyrmling.
Wyrms are generally really tough (Ex. Smaug from 'The Hobbit'), while their younger versions are not as tough, this is somewhat backwards to how humans age (weak-strong-weak vs weak-strong-reallystrong).
And besides, Wyrm sound cooler, and it's always best to save coole names for more powerful creatures.
B) Flyer? Why would a water[/e]-based creature fly?
if anything it should be unaffected by water-based moats.
C) What's with this divine presence? Not only does divine imply it's celestial in some way but generally dragons scare the opposing side, not use bard-magic to pump up their allies.
D) This ability should be called 'Tidal Force', and should be a long cone effect that lowers hit opponent's defenses.
C) (Not underlined)
Leviathan is a much better name for the water wyrm, it is true there are far too many dragons, the above note is me ranting about how wyrms are more powerful that mere dragons.
D) (not underlined)
Remember- NOT EVERYTHING NEEDS AN UPGRADE
If you please, take a look at the fine example of HOMM2
* * *
Sorry, I'm a bit finky about this sort of thing.
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Spaek the Titan
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted October 03, 2006 03:13 AM |
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Baklava! I shall not let u stand against the forces of darkness alone!!!
Your crab people comment got me laughing my ass off. I saw that episode too. too funny. My stronghold creatures all made it except for the giant elephants... goblin, orc, wolf rider, shaman, wyvern, troll. How can you call it crappy? Most the initial abilities made it through as well. But they were definately improved upon.
I know nagas are based on indian mythology but i thought we augment it with the mayan culture. i think it was action jack who suggested it.
Here's my 10 cents:
level 1. keep the name and creature
level 2. keep the creatures but change the name and make it stand out more.
level 3. Temple Guard - Elite Guard
Level 4. Sentinel - Grand Sentinel (Croc Rider - Basilisk Rider. Please keep those creatures cuz i cant stand turtles. Basilisks are vicious)
Level 5. Templar - Praetorian (Warden-Praetorian. Large four armed naga. Let's include that slither ability to make it like a teleporter)
Level 6. Priestess - High Priestess (Nice name. Consider keeping them)
Level 7. I don't like the name leviathan. But i would like to see this giant snake like creature without wings personally. Water Wyrm - ?? Wyrm. It could look like the basilisk from harry potter 2.
I don't see whats wrong wif having 3 walkers in a row. The dungeon pulled it off well. But yeah lets make the level 5 a teleporter if you are adamant. Everything needs an upgrade.
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actionjack
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 03, 2006 05:24 AM |
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just putting some opinions... (I do like to be nosie afterall)
-On Wyrm... I thought that was usually to describe a bad, infamouse dragon (wyrm = worm?) I think that word is more use to protrait a more dirty-evil-non-majastic dragon. Usually assocated with smaller-non-intellegent dragon-kind. Atleast thats how I see it....
-The Mayan/Inca theme are more base off the H3's fortress town.  Also I think it is the Mayan who live in a more swampy jungle area.
- I still want dragon fly! (tantrum)
 Its such clever name...
- Deathroll still seem strange.... I just saw a animal documentry about croc, and can clearly see they do roll alot.. but mostly in water. Its hard to roll if on land and with a rider. (maybe Side Step?)
-Would alwasy go from Swamp Wyrm > Leviathan. The swamp wyrm can go with more of a swamp dirty look (with vines and alggy hanging all over the body), while Leviathan have a more clean look. I agree in not making them a flyer.
- I still like the Ritual Sacrifse (tore out the heart of enemy to please your god) racial ablity. Since they are swamp theme, and swamp are usually more evil, I see them as a evil faction. Ritual Sacrifse would give extra bonus of power with more additional kill (something like that, won't go into detail), which make their battle strategy more of a "drawing the first blood". This give them certain advantages when face with another more agressive oppoent, but not as good if you face a more defensive one.
But since I don't think folks will make it a evil town, so I am still awaiting for a propose racial ablity before can commite more.
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