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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted April 26, 2009 10:38 PM |
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Eh - we can already cure Malaria, right?
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted April 26, 2009 10:39 PM |
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Quote:
Eh - we can already cure Malaria, right?
If we got a cure for it why have we not gotten rid of it then? Logical simple question.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted April 26, 2009 11:05 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Eh - we can already cure Malaria, right?
If we got a cure for it why have we not gotten rid of it then? Logical simple question.
Because it always comes down to money. Like Blizzardboy correctly, if somewhat cynically pointed out, nobody cares about Africa - or at least, nobody cared to bug out with medicine for about 1.000.000.000 Africans and probably at least the same number of Asians.
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 26, 2009 11:18 PM |
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Malaria can be cured by many substances. With some drugs its quite an easy three day treatment actually.
The big problem, Del Diablo, is that Anopheles mosquitoes infect people much faster than we can treat them, fact that only means three things. 1 - Sometimes people die faster than we can treat them. 2 - The excessive use of medications has caused the development of highly resistant protozoan subtypes. 3 - The poorer parts of subsaharian Africa, which are the most heavily affected by the disease, rarely have access to the sometimes expensive medication.
Results: Deaths, specially children. Plus, we dont develop immunity against it once we had it, so every year during malaria season, many people who survived last season may this time perish.
Which leaves us with a single perspective. Preventing it. Prophylaxis. But malaria prophylaxis is at this point still far from reality. We are left with two last resorts, chronical taking of medication (can be done for years) and mosquito nets (which can be surprisingly effective). But since there is no vaccine up to that point which could effectively prevent Malaria, our african brothers and sisters are still in severe danger.
Actually I'd be lying if I said that there is no effective vaccine. We have a very promissing vaccine being introduced since a couple of months with an estimated protection rate of around 50%. It may sound awfully low, but if you ask me, in such a complex situation, I would anytime inject a substance in my child that has a 50% chance not to work. And thats how they've been doing it.
Im longing for the final metanalyisis of those studies! This is the most exciting thing within the malaria panorama in a while. I hope it proves itself worthy.
But enough with this off topic now. I hope I have brought some info for those who wished it. Sorry for those who do not like medical stuff!
W.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted April 26, 2009 11:20 PM |
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What do you think about a possible vaccine for a very special price popping out soon? (for Pig Flu, I mean)
Is this too much of a conspiracy theory?
I hate those but I find such scenario quite possible.
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 26, 2009 11:25 PM |
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What if it's a reverse-engineered disease?
[/conspiracy]
Malaria is one of the most ancient diseases know to mankind. The very name of it stems from the old-roman latin: Mal aire. Bad air. Because back then it was attributed to the "filthy" air of the swamps. Malaria has been killing all along history and if it was reverse engineered, than hands down to the ancient-babylonian infectologist.
Sorry about the joke. I mean no disrespect.
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winterfate
Supreme Hero
Water-marked Champion!
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posted April 26, 2009 11:28 PM |
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@Wolfsburg: I would NEVER become a doctor. 
I am studying Microbiology though, and I have to agree with the mass media hysteria theory being thrown around. 
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If you supposedly care about someone, then don't push them out of your life. Acting like you're not doing it doesn't exempt you from what I just said. - Winterfate
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 26, 2009 11:40 PM |
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Quote:
What do you think about a possible vaccine for a very special price popping out soon? (for Pig Flu, I mean)
Is this too much of a conspiracy theory?
I hate those but I find such scenario quite possible.
No its not too much of a conspiracy theory. But I highly doubt the expensive product in question would come out to be a vaccine. We have hard legislation around the globe to prevent vaccine prices to go increadibly high during epidemic times (we live in a demand-offer market-logic, you can certainly figure out why those prices have to be held back during such outbreaks).
But a fantastic antiviral MEDICATION... oh boy. There we have GOLD business! During the so claimed bird-flu outbreak we had. The medicament Oseltamivir, aka Tamiflu, was sold like water in the desert. The swiss health-ministry for instance has recomended it to all swiss citizens. The mass production in "pill-land" was too slow to feed even internal consumers. Price was not outrageous, but not cheap either.
Facts are. Switzerland stays as it always was. No bird-flu, no epidemy. Some actual studies point by the way, that the virus has mutated in such a way that around 86% of its current variants are RESISTANT to oseltamivir.
Wandering what to do with the pills you got saved home for the end-of-times? They too.
W.
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 26, 2009 11:41 PM |
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@Winterfate:
I am studying Microbiology though...
A BEAUTIFUL area, my friend. Congrats.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted April 26, 2009 11:44 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 23:45, 26 Apr 2009.
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Quote:
Malaria is one of the most ancient diseases know to mankind. The very name of it stems from the old-roman latin: Mal aire. Bad air. Because back then it was attributed to the "filthy" air of the swamps. Malaria has been killing all along history and if it was reverse engineered, than hands down to the ancient-babylonian infectologist.
I don't get what you meant.
I meant that someone could reverse-engineer the "Pig flu" into a new mutated disease with more resistance or something like that. Maybe reverse-engineer the ordinary flu and this is what happens. You know, Biological warfare testing?
I was being serious, in a way.
EDIT: I should admit I'm speaking from computer information systems experiences and reverse-engineering in that area. So I could be wrong.
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The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 26, 2009 11:49 PM |
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I don't get what you meant.
I meant that someone could reverse-engineer the "Pig flu" into a new mutated disease with more resistance or something like that. Maybe reverse-engineer the ordinary flu and this is what happens. You know, Biological warfare testing?
Ohhhh you were speaking about pig-flu (face slap), sorry I thought you meant malaria as a reverse-engineered disease. Pig-flu? Yes. Why not. I mean i think its improbable, but not impossible. No serious man of science would refute a hypothesis completely without contundent proof.
So yes, there is a possibility. Do I believe it to be true? No. Flu viruses mutate too fast to be manipulated with success. Even if you would archieve a genetically "perfect" virus, it would soon enough mutate again and spoil your whole fun.
Sorry about the confusion there. Its only that the subjects got mixed.
W.
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted April 27, 2009 11:13 AM |
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But since there is no vaccine up to that point which could effectively prevent Malaria, our african brothers and sisters are still in severe danger.
I think we got a language problem, because if i put it in my language cure also means immunity. A cure is someting that preverts the bad from happening, and bluntly put that is what a vacine also is.
Quote:
Actually I'd be lying if I said that there is no effective vaccine. We have a very promissing vaccine being introduced since a couple of months with an estimated protection rate of around 50%. It may sound awfully low, but if you ask me, in such a complex situation, I would anytime inject a substance in my child that has a 50% chance not to work. And thats how they've been doing it.
50% is quite high, 1 will survive for each person that goes 10 feet under. I would call that a somewhat effective vacine intil the 95% arrives.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted April 27, 2009 01:31 PM |
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Quote:
Malaria can be cured by many substances. With some drugs its quite an easy three day treatment actually.
The big problem, Del Diablo, is that Anopheles mosquitoes infect people much faster than we can treat them, fact that only means three things. 1 - Sometimes people die faster than we can treat them. 2 - The excessive use of medications has caused the development of highly resistant protozoan subtypes. 3 - The poorer parts of subsaharian Africa, which are the most heavily affected by the disease, rarely have access to the sometimes expensive medication.
Results: Deaths, specially children. Plus, we dont develop immunity against it once we had it, so every year during malaria season, many people who survived last season may this time perish.
Which leaves us with a single perspective. Preventing it. Prophylaxis. But malaria prophylaxis is at this point still far from reality. We are left with two last resorts, chronical taking of medication (can be done for years) and mosquito nets (which can be surprisingly effective). But since there is no vaccine up to that point which could effectively prevent Malaria, our african brothers and sisters are still in severe danger.
Actually I'd be lying if I said that there is no effective vaccine. We have a very promissing vaccine being introduced since a couple of months with an estimated protection rate of around 50%. It may sound awfully low, but if you ask me, in such a complex situation, I would anytime inject a substance in my child that has a 50% chance not to work. And thats how they've been doing it.
Im longing for the final metanalyisis of those studies! This is the most exciting thing within the malaria panorama in a while. I hope it proves itself worthy.
But enough with this off topic now. I hope I have brought some info for those who wished it. Sorry for those who do not like medical stuff!
W.
Nice post. Thanx for informing. 
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What will happen now?
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 27, 2009 04:17 PM |
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Anytime, Alci
It is my pleasure. I possibly like to discuss it as much as Vassilev loves to discuss economy.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted April 27, 2009 05:17 PM |
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The microbiology? Be my guest, I studied biology once, still remember some things, but not too much I'm afraid!
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 28, 2009 01:32 AM |
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In a funny way, studying bacteria, protozoa and antibiotics is much like deeply understanding every unit on Heroes, you have to know them well so you play your cards right and defeat them.
Just as a humble example: would you toss ice bolts on obsidian gargoyles? No, its mostly a waste of mana, for no concrete effect. Very similarly, are you going to use antibiotics that target cell-wall against bacteria that have no cell-walls at all? Same answer.
The similarities seem to go on and on. You have to think carefully of how fast you must act, how agressive, consider retaliation before striking (sometimes killing all bacteria just liberates more toxins in the blood, or damage the kidneys/liver). You have to plan carefully how to react when they outnumber your forces, or how to sustain a siege when the situation is almost lost.
It is quite often not as entertaining as a computer game, the responsibilities are not funny at all and the outcomes are sometimes devastating for both the patient and the doctor. But it still requires a hell lot of strategy and agressive thinking.
And sometimes you win. Sometimes against all odds. And there is no sweeter prize then such victories.
A lovely science, indeed.
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted April 28, 2009 02:20 AM |
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 28, 2009 02:28 AM |
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Quote:
are you going to use antibiotics that target cell-wall against bacteria that have no cell-walls at all?
Wait, I thought all bacteria had cell walls. Made of peptidoglycan, right?
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Eccentric Opinion
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Wolfsburg
Promising
Known Hero
... the Vampire Doc
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posted April 28, 2009 02:38 AM |
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Quote:
Wait, I thought all bacteria had cell walls. Made of peptidoglycan, right?
Bingo. Very good, Vass. Thats the substance.
But no, not all bacteria have cell-walls, we've been discovering a broad array of bacteria which have no cell-walls at all. Some of them need a host cell to survive. And some manage it even without a host cell.
Thanks for the warnings on bird-flu Blizzardboy
I'll try not to kiss any wild birds on the following days. Nor swines.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted April 28, 2009 03:40 AM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 03:41, 28 Apr 2009.
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Quote:
In a funny way, studying bacteria, protozoa and antibiotics is much like deeply understanding every unit on Heroes, you have to know them well so you play your cards right and defeat them.
Just as a humble example: would you toss ice bolts on obsidian gargoyles? No, its mostly a waste of mana, for no concrete effect. Very similarly, are you going to use antibiotics that target cell-wall against bacteria that have no cell-walls at all? Same answer.
The similarities seem to go on and on. You have to think carefully of how fast you must act, how agressive, consider retaliation before striking (sometimes killing all bacteria just liberates more toxins in the blood, or damage the kidneys/liver). You have to plan carefully how to react when they outnumber your forces, or how to sustain a siege when the situation is almost lost.
It is quite often not as entertaining as a computer game, the responsibilities are not funny at all and the outcomes are sometimes devastating for both the patient and the doctor. But it still requires a hell lot of strategy and agressive thinking.
And sometimes you win. Sometimes against all odds. And there is no sweeter prize then such victories.
A lovely science, indeed.
You make it sound a lot more interesting than it actually is at least how I've seen it, for some reason, I never liked any biology whatsoever, it felt so boring and hard (you have to learn too much stuff by rote -- I mean, it's not like it has many mathematical or logical relationships). But it's ok I can accept different tastes.
Also if you put it in perspective, biology is all about reverse-engineering, since you are studying an already-designed 'machine' (well biological machine  ), so this could also be a limited factor for some. But good luck with it 
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The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
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