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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted October 10, 2012 11:50 PM |
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NWC didn't have to create guidelines because they actually developed their own games (oh snaaap).
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Verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted October 11, 2012 12:28 AM |
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Edited by Verriker at 00:31, 11 Oct 2012.
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I was googling a bit on this topic and found an hilarious link.
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Endbringer
Adventuring Hero
Devil's Bane
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posted October 11, 2012 01:45 AM |
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Yes, the campaign storylines were indeed terrible in Heroes V and VI. It's unfortunate, because in my opinion, the world of Ashan has some cool lore (with the current retcons at least) and is a great layout for a video game setting.
I just hope by the last installment of Heroes VI, they will have an at least semi-interesting campaign that you will actually want to finish, have at least 7-9 factions, and perhaps not have COUNTLESS bugs anymore.
I honestly couldn't care less if Dragons come back as a usable unit, just as long as Dungeon has at least a little variety in their creature types.
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samir
Hired Hero
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posted October 11, 2012 04:10 AM |
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ahhh bummer... I really thought they would cut the black dragon from the lineup but still not.
Why the spoiled fans always get their ways?
So they can't break their mythology of the dwarves but they can break their promise that the dragons are gods and no mere creatures because fans whine over some boring black dragon unit?
I really thought hydra or faceless here... would have liked that more than the king of overusedness, the dragon.
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GenyaArikado
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
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posted October 11, 2012 05:29 AM |
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I still think that shapeshifting Drago-faceless would be awesome
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Endbringer
Adventuring Hero
Devil's Bane
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posted October 11, 2012 05:42 AM |
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@Samir
Wait, has it been confirmed?
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted October 11, 2012 08:24 AM |
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Time to bring some more light into this
first Verriker
You spoke in a rather sarcastic way about how Ubi did not manage to get any prais for their MaM game. This is a Big wrong. They did not manage to get any prais for thier heroes vanila game. Like Heroes V at the beginning. At the Time of ToE it became on of themos popular and most repsected parts of the series. surpasing Heroes IV and II in many fields of popularity. And if we focuse on the spinnoffs Both full game spinoffs that have been officially published, That is Dark Messiah and Clash of Heroes, were more then successfull game. Dark messiah was rather more popular by europian customers then to the US ones, but its combat system, even if 4 years old, has offten been seen as superiro to even such MAGEHIT games like Skyrim. And it would still be seen such way if Arcane studious, who made the game, would not published their long awaited Dishonerd tomorow.
Now lets get to Clash of Heroes. A geme praised so many times that it hold the title "Best downloadable game" in two years. The game recieved more positiv featback than Heroes IV-V and VI at the time of their publishing. And both of these games are made by this same guidline that you think did not bring Ubi any respect.
Now to Avirosb and his Example
I will bring up a little bit of an old age argument about just one character from the Enroth game, The Lich Ethric the mad. Who was this character, when did he die? And how come if the games were developed in the spam of 5 years did they not manage to make a single character without some basic questions about him beeing uneasy to understand.
Just examples from the game texts
MaM VI: Ethirc is depicted as beeing the first Lich, His toomb beeing build an entire generation back.
Heroes III SoD: You encounter Ethirc as a warlock, on the side of the warlocks Hunting his former student Sandro. (We can see a paraler to Danse Marcarb)
This would all be OK. Many people noted that there could be two Ethrics. But How big of a chance would be, that there are tow characters of the same name, both connected to Liches.
But then the MaM VII comes and lets you find the staff of an Ethric, The first Lich Ethric. So how did a staff of an Enrothian Grand Lich got to Antagarich? Well, it could be left behind when he got illed by his former student.
So we have one character who is described to Live in one world, die in another one, be buried back in the first one, who is the first lich, who is described as a sourcerr and a Necromancer and aperantly has something against his students following the necromancer path.
To be short They did not think about this much. They just created a character and thought it was cool, and it would be cool to reuse it, without considering if its story would be consisten or logical. Ubi tries to aviod this. There are some small problems but not as big as NWC's free policy had. (next topic would be Minotaurs, want to start it?)
Now to the topic Of Dragons.
There was never a statement that said 'All Dragons are god's or Godlike creatures". There are 3 creatures that can bee seen as dragons.
1: The dragon gods: The live in their plain/sfers/worlds not interacting with the material world directly to keep it in piece.
2: Avatars: These creatures are usually spirits and manifestations of the particular god, or his aspect. Like the Dragon Eel or Cate.
3: Normal Dragons: Creatures that live at the same time in the matierial world and the spirit world and are the True children of the gods. They are unnaturally strong but not gods. They can't be banished like spirits. They are Dragons as you would understand them, not a god or an avatar. We could see only one of these in Heroes VI sofar, the Dragonwraight, which is not a living dragon, but it is a resurrected corps of one. This is also en example that they are not like Gods or avatars. They can be killed, and resurrected. Not as easilly as other creatures but they can be. A normal dragon could very well be a Champion unit. Since the Power scale of a game mechanic is nothing that we should consider a Lore fact. We cant say "Goblins are as strong as Archers" just because the game balance/mechanics needed them to be similar.
End from me fo now.
____________
I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted October 11, 2012 08:37 AM |
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There also seem to be some freaking large dragons around if the dragonwraith, the skeleton in Fiona's campaign(Clash) or the skeleton near Miranda's castle are any indication. It is not specified if they can get there with age or they were more majestic in the past. I sure wish the dragon utopia would be a boss fight if easier than a typical boss  That would be so much fun.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted October 11, 2012 08:45 AM |
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Edited by Avirosb at 08:49, 11 Oct 2012.
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Quote:
Now lots get to Clash of Heroes. A geme praised so many times that it hold the title "Best downloadable game" of two years. The game recieved more positiv featback than Heroes IV-V
Of course it sold well, people are suckers for animu.
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But How big of a chance would be, that there are tow characters of the same name, both connected to Liches.
Pretty big, Enroth is a pretty big place.
Quote:
next topic would be Minotaurs, want to start it?
Actually, Actually, I'm more interested in knowing how liches surpasses vampires in H5, why glories and sisters get replaced with clerics and peasants and why two of the inferno units in H6 look like balrogs and why the cerberi grew an extra head since then.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted October 11, 2012 09:02 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Now lots get to Clash of Heroes. A geme praised so many times that it hold the title "Best downloadable game" of two years. The game recieved more positiv featback than Heroes IV-V
Of course it sold well, people are suckers for animu.
That's a close-minded statement. It sold well because it was so much fun. But you wouldn't know, would you?
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted October 11, 2012 09:16 AM |
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Quote:
Pretty big, Enroth is a pretty big place.
So why do they reused so many characters?
Quote:
Actually, Actually, I'm more interested in knowing how liches surpasses vampires in H5, why glories and sisters get replaced with clerics and peasants and why two of the inferno units in H6 look like balrogs and why the cerberi grew an extra head since then.
Lets move to the Lore topic shall we? I think with the combined power of Wer-Overlord, me and Avonu we could manage to answer most of this.
http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=37145&pagenumber=6
____________
I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted October 11, 2012 09:18 AM |
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Edited by Avirosb at 09:21, 11 Oct 2012.
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The first thing people do is look at the cover, I'm just saying.
And then they go "Ooh, anime characters!" and then it turns out it's a really good game.
But yeah, I wouldn't know because I hate when non-Asians resort
to that crude 'all-characters-have-the-same-face' "art style".
Quote:
So why do theyreused so many characters?
Why does Ubi keep on reintroducing them?
Because they're so drat popular, that's why.
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Endbringer
Adventuring Hero
Devil's Bane
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posted October 11, 2012 09:24 AM |
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@Dave_Jame
Quote:
first Endbringer
You spoke in a rather sarcastic way about how Ubi did not manage to get any prais for there MaM game.
I don't think I made any statement of that sort. The only negative feedback I give to Ubisoft are the bugs and the terrible campaign storylines.
If I wasn't being clear or I came off as sarcastic, I want to be clear that I honestly think that the Ubisoft Might & Magic world is a very good fantasy setting, even though they have had to retcon a few things.
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted October 11, 2012 09:44 AM |
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Quote:
But yeah, I wouldn't know because I hate when non-Asians resort
to that crude 'all-characters-have-the-same-face' "art style".
You know, I was just like you, but then I tried the game. And you know what, it is a good game, with a good story.
Quote:
Why does Ubi keep on reintroducing them?
Because they're so drat popular, that's why.
Well to be honist. At the early days NWC just copied everything they could just to save resources/advertise to people. That is when the first dual caracter wave came in. I do not think Ethirc was such an interesting character, he was only a backgroudn info in the first game and apart from some localization's you cold not even encounter him (ex: You can not in the EN version but you can in the CZ one).
But you generally say, that if a character is "interesting" it is logical to use it again. So if they introduced a similar character from the same world in the next game it can hint us that it is the same one?
@Endbringer
Edited
Sorry once more for the confusion I hope i was not that bad on you.
____________
I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted October 11, 2012 09:54 AM |
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@Dave_Jame
I think you are confusing Endbringer with Verriker. Understandable since they both use the same avatar, but you did wrongly accuse him.
Quote:
And can you give me a source where NWC said they had no rules or guidelines for the world in Heroes I-IV.
Link To an interview with Julien "Marzhin" Pirou, where he said the following:
Quote:
Joke aside, I think the old worlds of Might & Magic had this ""Dungeons & Dragons"" quality, it was very naive and creative like the world a young, enthusiastic Gamemaster would create for his Pen and Paper role playing sessions. You could feel they were pretty much improvising as they went along, there was no real ""bible"" or ""rules"" set beforehand, anything could happen: robots, blasters, spaceships, elemental planes, time travel... If someone thought adding a Lich with a Thundercats belt was funny, it would find its way into the game. It was a very fun setting, but sometimes it didn't make much sense.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted October 11, 2012 10:01 AM |
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Quote:
The first thing people do is look at the cover, I'm just saying.
And then they go "Ooh, anime characters!" and then it turns out it's a really good game.
But yeah, I wouldn't know because I hate when non-Asians resort
to that crude 'all-characters-have-the-same-face' "art style".
irrelevant but i want to say about clash of heroes that it was indeed very fun, but the design with the emo haircuts and the child heroes was despicable and made it childish. it's not about anime,i think they targeted younger ages with that for some reason!
and since i'm posting i want to say that i do not want to see a dragon as a champion unit in any faction! if we were to have dragons, necro would have their bone/ghost dragon, and maybe sancruary would have a sea dragon. dragons are predictable and the non use of them will bring something more original and fun.
____________
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Endbringer
Adventuring Hero
Devil's Bane
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posted October 11, 2012 10:37 AM |
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Quote:
irrelevant but i want to say about clash of heroes that it was indeed very fun, but the design with the emo haircuts and the child heroes was despicable and made it childish. it's not about anime,i think they targeted younger ages with that for some reason!
Behold! The least intimidating Necromancer EVER!
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted October 11, 2012 10:39 AM |
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Ooops.. thanks War and sorry Endbringer
The avatar thing confused me.. all will be edited
But I dare you insult Fiona :-P... Take this
____________
I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted October 11, 2012 10:49 AM |
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Whatever goes on around her waistline, it looks uncomfortable 
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ShardofTruth
Hired Hero
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posted October 11, 2012 10:53 AM |
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Quote:
Yes, the campaign storylines were indeed terrible in Heroes V and VI.
There are not any worse than the stories of King's Bounty or Heroes II-III (Heroes I didn't has a story, just a motivation), I give you that they're trying too hard sometimes but other than that they're pretty much the same thing.
Heroes IV and Heroes Chronicles had some better written stories, although they were mainly text window after text window and not related to most of the events on the map (which is a bad thing in my opinion).
I think it's very difficult to make a compelling story for a game with turn-based strategy mechanics, either they look awful (Disciples comes to mind) or they are text heavy and presented even more boring (Heroes II-IV). I was insulted by the still standing and reused images of the Heroes IV campaign, could someone be more lazy?
So I appreciated Nival's efforts to make cutscenes, even if they lacked moving mouths in the beginning and are a riddled with spell effects and Heroes VI cleary improved here too.
Quote:
Quote:
"who cares, anything goes" attitude of the early games and avoid the equally contrived attempt to weave everything together afterward.
Example?
- the included "events" of Heroes I in Heroes II
- most of the Armageddon's Blade stuff is really tied forcefully with the Heroes Chronicles afterwards (Mutare, Sword of Frost, etc.)
- And what is it about the Ancients? Even when directly included in the World Tree und Fiery Moon it's a giant mess.
- The same is true for the Shadow of Death campaigns, which are essentially of the same importance as the Price of Loyality campaigns but somehow weaved together in the most fan fiction manner I can imagine and even then not reflected/foreshadowed in Might and Magic VII in the slightest (which is a problem for all Heroes games and their RPG counterparts).
That's from my memory so some of this may be incorrect and don't get me wrong, I really like NWC games (that's why I played most of them ).
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