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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 10:30 PM |
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That's all bullcrap. Smoke and mirrors. There is a war on, it takes place on Ukrainian ground, it destroys Ukrainian houses, industry, infrastructure. It destroys life on both sides, but civilians only on the Ukrnian side.
For what?
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 10:36 PM |
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Quote:
In principle, the consumer society itself is already the soft power of the West (and we all grew up in the consumer society in one way or another).
This is true. Do you know that the US provided humanitarian aid to Belarus while Russia did nothing because Russia needed it, too. I remember Uncle Bens, which my grandmother called "the most nutritious rice ever" and Wagon Wheels which I ate on both cheeks. Those deeds were real one while Russia didn't do anything to help their brother country. Also you can't argue with that fact that the whole generation of the 90's grew up on American films. Well, do you really think that it was a nasty American plan to enslave my generation? I don't think so, my generation was fed up of the USSR rules, and hailed the newfound freedom.
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imswear
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 25, 2022 10:40 PM |
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AlexSpl said:
Quote:
Because I selfishly don't want these things to affect my personal life.
This is the greatest weakness of an individual. All we have is our own life. We don't know anything but our life. It's unique for every person in this world. And all oppresions come from the idea of exploiting this natural weakness. If you delve into history, you'll find many torturing mechanisms created to break the will of the people. Man is pathethic. The showcase is Hitler's war. People killed another people to not being killed themselves. If I were the consiousness of humanity, my color would be red from blood. Still we think our souls are spotless, every new generation thinks so. We are wiser than our fathers, we can do this and that. And if you are a successful one, in your 90's you will understand the ultimate truth of this live - everything should have its end. I think that this is a biochemical process, the very nature alters our imagination and will. And we transform from romantic youths watching the moon on a frosty night to those who send bullets to people which we've never met in reality. I hate the fact that a person is a piece of plasticine. Do we really defend our own beliefs? Or we just a sum of what we read, watch and hear?
As I said earlier, I am not a neutral person who thinks it has nothing to do with myself.
In fact, this war has affected my life. Make everything worse.
However, I don't think this is a battlefield. There are no enemies here.
In any case, I can't influence the decision-makers who hold great power.
They don't care about our lives.
So it's a deep sense of powerlessness.
A person is helpless. Only consensus can form strength.
I don't know whether there is consensus under the separation of ideas.
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Ben80
Famous Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 10:47 PM |
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Edited by Ben80 at 22:52, 25 Mar 2022.
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@AlexSpl
I don't want to tell you something impolite (because I've already said a lot). I think you are talking nonsense. What is this: "I don't think so, my generation was fed up of the USSR rules, and hailed the newfound freedom."
How could they bother you if you almost never lived in the USSR in adulthood ? (and even now, in my opinion, you don’t understand well what’s what)
As it is now fashionable to say - "that's all you need to know about..."
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 10:54 PM |
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Quote:
I don't want to tell you something impolite (because I've already said a lot). I think you are talking nonsense. What is this: "I don't think so, my generation was fed up of the USSR rules, and hailed the newfound freedom."
How could they bother you if you almost never lived in the USSR in adulthood ? (and even now, in my opinion, you don’t understand well what’s what)
OK. I *remember* the dusk of the USSR. 88-89. And if you remember the USSR where people lived happily, I will listen with pleasure. But my USSR was the prison, and what followed just after its collapse, is beyond any fubar. I doubt any European would believe in this snow. So, we are unique post-Soviet generation in some sense, who know the price of freedom and stalls full of goods. Won't argue with you if you say that it's not true. I have witnessed this and can compare. Sorry, that I don't share your USSR's views as I don't live in your times of the USSR's prosperity.
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imswear
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 25, 2022 10:54 PM |
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Edited by imswear at 22:55, 25 Mar 2022.
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Ben80 said:
@AlexSpl
I don't want to tell you something impolite (because I've already said a lot). I think you are talking nonsense. What is this: "I don't think so, my generation was fed up of the USSR rules, and hailed the newfound freedom."
How could they bother you if you almost never lived in the USSR in adulthood ? (and even now, in my opinion, you don’t understand well what’s what)
Realistically, Putin does not support returning to the Soviet Union.
Secondly, if return to the Soviet Union, Russia will instantly double its enemies, not just the western countries. It may include neighboring countries such as ……
Maybe.
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Ben80
Famous Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 10:58 PM |
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Edited by Ben80 at 22:58, 25 Mar 2022.
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imswear said:
Realistically, Putin does not support returning to the Soviet Union.
Yes, this is a return to tsarist Russia. But given the rich history of Russia, there is an idea that over the next decades, Russian society can change very strongly in some direction. But one condition is necessary - the country itself must prolong its existence.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 11:18 PM |
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What I'm pretty sure of is that you can't just break all international relations. Actually I didn't know that Europe so weak when we speak about gas. This is a whole theme for a book. Well, it's not new news anyway. I roll on the floor laughing while reading negotiations of so called enemies  All this economic battles are so distant from the reality when people die every day from both sides. You hear?! DIE. Dead people don't need gas, you can even check this by becoming one of them. I hate this world for its dishonesty. People continue to make money on other people deaths. Europe fears that it will freeze their legs, while the neighboring country is bathed in blood. well, I'm not judging. but this case is an example. Nobody will help Europe either.
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Ben80
Famous Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 11:23 PM |
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AlexSpl said:
Quote:
In principle, the consumer society itself is already the soft power of the West (and we all grew up in the consumer society in one way or another).
This is true.
Did you read as a child "Malchish-kibalchish" ? For a jar of jam and a pack of biscuits... I hope that even the generation that grew up in the era of consumption still has not even some concepts, but, let's say, instincts. About, for example, where is the brink of betrayal.
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Ben80
Famous Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 11:27 PM |
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AlexSpl said:
Europe fears that it will freeze their legs, while the neighboring country is bathed in blood.
In this regard, the best thing Europe can do is not provide any military assistance to Ukraine. However, I have already expressed doubts about the logic of your reasoning here.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 25, 2022 11:38 PM |
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You won't believe but I read the Soviet school program to the fullest. And mind, I don't blame the USSR which I didn't know, I can't check if it was the greatest country on Earth as I was told in school. I just remember the mendicant USSR. And, even elder people who knew more than me were glad to see Latin serials on TV. Belive me, no one would want to come back, and this was the greatest escape for Soviet people. You can argue about the former, strong and helthy USSR, but our generation remembers only its faults and weaknesses. I understand that the USSR was a counterpart for the US. Both countries were bound into one great competition. Alas, our idea failed miserably due to awful implementation and corruption. Also the Soviet leadership tried to reformat the human itself, make it ideal. It's a big mistake. This alone made Soviet people think that they live in a prison.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 26, 2022 12:18 AM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 00:18, 26 Mar 2022.
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The USSR in a nutshell - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0QuEpg4V4U
Sorry, I understand that you won't understand words. But in our post-Soviet reality English was a must. Few remembers those times when your only guide to programming was on English. Actually, most "modern" Russians don't understand that all their digital world is American digital world. They were born after the great collapse and credited with all the achievements of the digital industry to Russia, they don't know that Russians are incapacle to create even Core i3. And Russian know it. They prefereed to spend money building Kinzhals. It's not an accusation, it's a fact. Actually the USSR itself were robbers. Their spies were stealing technology. But you can't really prosper by stealing. Even Russian jets are copies of the American figher jets. Still Russia cannot recreate F-35 because it's very expensive jet. All that they can do is to poor mud at its architecture. Just one F-35 is capable to close the sky over Ukraine. And I'm not joking. F-35 Lightning 2 is almost invincible jet. Russians said - who is strong in the sky is strong in general. And they know that F-35 is the king of the sky.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 26, 2022 01:01 AM |
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Ben80
Famous Hero
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posted March 26, 2022 04:58 AM |
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Edited by Ben80 at 08:02, 26 Mar 2022.
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I really feel sorry for people like you. Far from all people who grew up outside the USSR could repeat the most terrifying clichés of Western propaganda in such an absurd form.
This is similar to the actions of punishers during World War II -
the Germans did not commit such cruelties against the civilian population as traitors of non-German origin. The inner world of traitors is always hell.
I probably offended you and you also tried to say something unpleasant to me. However, such frankly crazy things just surprise me, less often laugh (there are such posts in this thread). I never argue with such things, and I personally understood everything about you much earlier than today (as soon as you started writing on handbookhmm.ru on these topics, everything immediately became clear).
You can't even imagine what a weak impression you make when you try to talk about things not related to programming (probably all your "ones" have accumulated in some one area, while others turned out to be "zeroes").
I caught you here several times on absurd things. I didn’t argue on some particular points - I just showed that you write absurd things.
So, about the F-35 - this aircraft was never intended to gain air superiority (so it can't "close the sky"). This is a fighter-bomber. Try to find out what it is.
To gain air superiority, there are other aircraft - this is the old F-15 and the newer (compared to it) F-22. In a number of cases, F-35 is capable of defending himself in air combat with fighters or interceptor fighters, but nothing more.
One of the best interceptor fighters of its time was the Soviet MiG-25 (which set many world records), now the MiG-31 is an excellent machine.
It is very stupid of you to express your opinion about military equipment at a time when this is being discussed and debated by real military experts. In the same way, it is stupid of you to talk about other things in the field of political science, cultural studies or history - but you seemed to purposely set out to show your ignorance in these matters.
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imswear
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 26, 2022 06:33 AM |
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Ben80 said:
imswear said:
Realistically, Putin does not support returning to the Soviet Union.
Yes, this is a return to tsarist Russia. But given the rich history of Russia, there is an idea that over the next decades, Russian society can change very strongly in some direction. But one condition is necessary - the country itself must prolong its existence.
Russia will not be "killed".
The great works created by Russia (such as Tolstoy, Tchaikovsky's literature, music, etc.) will continue to be handed down.
I don't think anyone wants and can kill Russia.
The world cannot afford the consequences. Killing others doesn't make you better, it's the opposite.
Unless it evolves into World War III (I cautiously don't think it will happen).
At that time, no one knew who would survive.
Einstein said: I don't know what weapons people used in World War III. But I know that the weapons of World War IV will be stones and sticks.
I don't even want seclusion, sanctions or the cold war to happen.
If you live on an isolated island, you will be more afraid of the outside world and people. You'll think everyone wants to kill you. (in fact, why should I count someone thousands of miles away? I'm too busy with my life to care.)
As long as everyone sits down to chat and play together, you will find that they are not so different from each other. As before, we gathered here to exchange and share the same game experience.
Even if there are cultural or ideological differences, I hope it will only stop at debate, not violence.
Then maybe you don't agree with me, I don't agree with you. Everyone does their own work. You write your code and I build my car. Through this economic and trade relationship, the quality of life of each other is still improved.
I'm depressed: who cares about our wishes. As long as I don't take up arms, someone will think your ideas are powerless. It seems that the world is comparing the strength of force - I disagree.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted March 26, 2022 11:50 AM |
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AlexSpl said:
...Europe fears that it will freeze their legs, while the neighboring country is bathed in blood...
This is exactly how "propaganda" works. And it works for those people who are not able/willing to think deeper about a given situation and just choose the answer which sounds best for the poor.
Journalism stlye of "The Sun" and "Bild"...
There is war in nearly every corner of this world currently. For those who think Europe isn't helping Ucraine enough these days...what did the Ucraine do the last 5 years to help other countries/people/ethnic groups which were involved in war action?
No disrespect to the ucrainian people...but getting help from all sides but still moaning that it should be more...could turn down the motivation of the helpers...
And maybe one should think about the effect of immediately stop buying gas from Russia...and not having an equal replacement the same time. People will runover the gas stations and hoard gas at home (remember toilet paper last year?). People get unemployed coz gas stations have nothing to sell, prizes will increase (what happened already), many people can't afford the doubled prizes already....so this war influences current life in europe more than many people think...
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted March 26, 2022 12:33 PM |
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@angelito. I see your point but I beg to differ, it is the Presidents duty to do everything he can to protect his people. Even guilt-tripping other countries leaders...or making them annoyed - to get help. His concern should not be - and is not - annoying foreigners at this time of crisis.
Luckily Russia is currently being beaten on all fronts. Sanctions are kicking in hard, no Russian planes can fly over Europe, companies are abandoning Russia, no investors want to invest in Russia, tens of thousands of Russian people are fleeing the soon to be second North-Korea resulting in brain-drain.. and finally, Ukrainians are even starting to push Russian troops back militarily. Heck they allegedly have more tanks now than when the war started.
Furthermore, almost every country wants to join NATO now. Because it would be idiotic not to.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted March 26, 2022 01:02 PM |
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Looks like the outlets you watch didn't detail who exactly those sanctions will be really kicking hard. And that's not Russia, who prepared to such situation beforehand, has strong economic allies and a population which will unite behind Putin if things go too far.
As for more countries joining NATO, go ahead, everything is already done to metamorphose a local conflict into a 3rd world war. Which EU can't afford anyway, but continues to play the bigmouth like it was otherwise.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 26, 2022 02:03 PM |
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If Russia doesn't want their neighbors to look for allies they should stop attacking them.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 26, 2022 03:28 PM |
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Quote:
I really feel sorry for people like you. Far from all people who grew up outside the USSR could repeat the most terrifying clichés of Western propaganda in such an absurd form.
Well, and I was surprised with your pro-Stalin views. I honestly thought that they were relics of the past. And please don't call common sense a "cliche". If people share common sense it does not automatically become a "cliche".
"And maybe one should think about the effect of immediately stop buying gas from Russia...and not having an equal replacement the same time."
Well, I understand that this is impossible. It's just another paradox of war. You continue to support your enemy 
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