|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
posted January 03, 2007 08:55 PM |
|
|
I know it's possible, even I attained some number near that when I played with Dougal.
But this means an army of: 600 marksmen, 70 squires... and that's it! No other creatures, you waste all your money on marksmen. Of course you may have some griffins and all that, but you don't recruit Angels (or other tier 7s), you lose some town points (useful for siege), and so on..
the point is: training peasants into archers COSTS more than the archer himself, so it's "wasted" money unless you REALLY recruited ALL the other creatures and have nothing to do with the money.
Just try yourself once to play without training unless you swim in gold, and then see that recruiting the other creatures will compensate for those 600 marksmen... So what if I have only 200 marksmen? I have paladins, griffins, Inquisitors, etc.. so in short you "sacrifice" these other units to marksmen as I said before.
____________
The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 09:01 PM |
|
|
well TowerLord said a few times that he doesn't use angels etc.
However, the paladins are a must (extra cleansing) so yes, this strategy IS expensive.. but since he never had any problems with it (or my friend, who also plays this strategy and beats me most of the time lol ;p) I think that it's not very difficult to perform.
|
|
VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 09:10 PM |
|
Edited by VokialBG at 21:10, 03 Jan 2007.
|
Quote:
I know it's possible, even I attained some number near that when I played with Dougal.
But this means an army of: 600 marksmen, 70 squires... and that's it! No other creatures, you waste all your money on marksmen. Of course you may have some griffins and all that, but you don't recruit Angels (or other tier 7s), you lose some town points (useful for siege), and so on..
the point is: training peasants into archers COSTS more than the archer himself, so it's "wasted" money unless you REALLY recruited ALL the other creatures and have nothing to do with the money.
Just try yourself once to play without training unless you swim in gold, and then see that recruiting the other creatures will compensate for those 600 marksmen... So what if I have only 200 marksmen? I have paladins, griffins, Inquisitors, etc.. so in short you "sacrifice" these other units to marksmen as I said before.
And what? You will have 8-12 paladins, 200 marksmen some Inquisitors, maybe few angels and many conscripts? And TowrLord will have 600 marksmen, 70 squires, and some griffins, and he will win!
|
|
RectusDominus
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 09:46 PM |
|
|
In my ''haven'' period  , I used to have like 300 marksmen, 65 squires, 35 griffins and 8 cavaliers at beginning of week 4, it rlly aint that expensive
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 09:54 PM |
|
|
Quote:
the point is: training peasants into archers COSTS more than the archer himself, so it's "wasted" money unless you REALLY recruited ALL the other creatures and have nothing to do with the money.
My experience tells me it's fairly easy to buy all creatures but angels,train the peasants AND upg cavaliers.The money for training and building hall of heroes is about the same as if you'd built angels and bought them.I may not build monks on week 2.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Dungeonian
Adventuring Hero
Supreme matriarch
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 09:59 PM |
|
|
It isn't a problem to have 600 marksmen on 6th week , the problem is , as The Death said , that it mean lack of high level units . Last time I'd play against haven my opponent had 580 marksmen , 14 paladins , 220 squires and 1+1+1+1 inquisitor leading by 20th lvl Laszlo . It was exactly on 6th week and I meet him with 9 Shadow dragons , 18+1+1 Shadow matriarchs , 52 Grim raiders , 105 Blood furies and 145 Assasins leading by 22th level Vaishan . I even choose Summoning instead of Destruction cause Wasp swarm has exellent 60% hamper on ATB , with Expert sorcery vs. marksmen with their poor 8 ini. it completely neitralize them . Laszlo gave sufficient bonus to sqiures , but Grim raiders are Grim raiders  .
I should mind that if he surprise me using other than marksmen strategy and build all troops , especialy Griffins , this map has Military posts of any faction producing 4th level , and choose Irina I might have a bit trouble without Destructive magic , but vs. slow marksmen wasp swarm made a game .
____________
The Darkness is the right hand of the Light , the Light is the left hand of the Darkness .
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 10:08 PM |
|
|
Only as long as the knight doesn't have mass haste and divine guidance.Then you'd rather have those destructive
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Dungeonian
Adventuring Hero
Supreme matriarch
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 10:25 PM |
|
|
He had mass haste , but Shadow matriarchs have slow.
____________
The Darkness is the right hand of the Light , the Light is the left hand of the Darkness .
|
|
VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
|
|
posted January 03, 2007 11:08 PM |
|
|
Quote:
He had mass haste , but Shadow matriarchs have slow.
Expert Light magic + Master of Wrath (mass haste) + some magic power, this is better than the Shadow matriarch's Slow on advanced level!
|
|
RectusDominus
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 04, 2007 12:03 AM |
|
|
Quote:
It isn't a problem to have 600 marksmen on 6th week , the problem is , as The Death said , that it mean lack of high level units . Last time I'd play against haven my opponent had 580 marksmen , 14 paladins , 220 squires and 1+1+1+1 inquisitor leading by 20th lvl Laszlo . It was exactly on 6th week and I meet him with 9 Shadow dragons , 18+1+1 Shadow matriarchs , 52 Grim raiders , 105 Blood furies and 145 Assasins leading by 22th level Vaishan . I even choose Summoning instead of Destruction cause Wasp swarm has exellent 60% hamper on ATB , with Expert sorcery vs. marksmen with their poor 8 ini. it completely neitralize them . Laszlo gave sufficient bonus to sqiures , but Grim raiders are Grim raiders .
I should mind that if he surprise me using other than marksmen strategy and build all troops , especialy Griffins , this map has Military posts of any faction producing 4th level , and choose Irina I might have a bit trouble without Destructive magic , but vs. slow marksmen wasp swarm made a game .
I think we were talking about the combination of Dougal and marksmen not laszlo or whoever, I think if ur not using dougal, a casual haven army is better
And if u wanna slow down marksmen, why not do it with lightning/stun or freezing magic
|
|
Dungeonian
Adventuring Hero
Supreme matriarch
|
|
posted January 04, 2007 12:56 AM |
|
|
Who loughs the last , loughs the best . It doesn't matter what level has haste or slow , only what spell is casted the last .
Also wasp swarm is better for stunning than lightning or freeze , cause it move on 60% turn back , but lightning and freeze only on 30% , which could be counter by divine guidance .
Also it doesn't matter what hero leads those marksmen till they are stunned and excluded from action . Dougal , as far as I know , doesn't increase marksmen initiative .
But all I said is my own experience , if you love Dougal play with him , I wish you success
____________
The Darkness is the right hand of the Light , the Light is the left hand of the Darkness .
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted January 04, 2007 12:59 AM |
|
|
Now summoning with the new firewall should be a fine choice as far as dungeon goes.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
mike11
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted January 04, 2007 08:31 AM |
|
|
Now that I'm playing the Sylvan campaign, it does seem to be a little weak. Its probably me not knowing what I'm doing, but I was a pretty active H4 player a few years ago.
____________
Wez - WoW Darkspear 60 UD Priest - Herb/Alch
Timezone = PST ( EST -3, GMT -8 )
Wez - WoW Archimonde 60 Human Priest
Wez - SWG Bria TKM/Doc/Fencer
Mike11 - HOMMIV TOH Legionaire
|
|
hellwitch
Known Hero
Skeleton Ruler
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 10:37 AM |
|
|
|
Sylvan are weekest because 1 mistake and the game is over. The evles die very easy and it is hard to keep them alive if there are many shooters and casters on the map. And untill week 3 you lose a lot of pixies and dansers to save the elves alive. Yes they can make a lot of damage but they die too easy. Wood dependence kill their progress in the end of the 2nd week and it is hard to get castle, threants and upgrates. So in my opinion Sylvan is the weekest race.
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 11:34 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Expert Light magic + Master of Wrath (mass haste) + some magic power, this is better than the Shadow matriarch's Slow on advanced level!
It doesn't matter as long as you cast the opposite spell "Slow vs Haste or viceversa".. Even if Haste is cast on Super Expert Level, and Slow on no level at all (not even Basic), it WILL dispel Haste and at the same time put the new "curse" on it (slow on no level)... that's the game 
Also stunning is much more ineffective than freezing -- it depends on whether the target has a high ATB or not (if it's low, then the stun will be veeery unnoticeable). So for stunning it's better if you use on stacks with a high ATB (it effectively multiplies the ATB with 0.7). The higher the ATB, the higher the decreasing ATB effect but it's always more ineffective than freezing
|
|
VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 11:42 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
Expert Light magic + Master of Wrath (mass haste) + some magic power, this is better than the Shadow matriarch's Slow on advanced level!
It doesn't matter as long as you cast the opposite spell "Slow vs Haste or viceversa".. Even if Haste is cast on Super Expert Level, and Slow on no level at all (not even Basic), it WILL dispel Haste and at the same time put the new "curse" on it (slow on no level)... that's the game
Also stunning is much more ineffective than freezing -- it depends on whether the target has a high ATB or not (if it's low, then the stun will be veeery unnoticeable). So for stunning it's better if you use on stacks with a high ATB (it effectively multiplies the ATB with 0.7). The higher the ATB, the higher the decreasing ATB effect but it's always more ineffective than freezing
AHHH, I mean the mass haste will be cast on all creatures, and the slow spell only on 1 creature!!!
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 11:51 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Sylvan are weekest because 1 mistake and the game is over.
This doesn't mean they are the weakest. This mean they are hard to master.
|
|
ZombieLord
Promising
Famous Hero
that wants your brainz...
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 01:36 PM |
|
|
I don't know what maps you play, but without gold mines even I have some problems with the Gold. Imagine with Training.
You play rich maps? I can make a map where you have 6 Gold mines for each player, and Haven will rule. That's it. It really depends on the map.
Oh yeah, Haven sucks at creeping because the first units are so slow...
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 01:44 PM |
|
Edited by TheDeath at 13:45, 05 Jan 2007.
|
ZombieLord: if you are willing to sacrifice tier 7s (aka Angels) and tier 5s (aka Inquisitors), I believe you will have some money for marksmen. Though it's unfair to call them overpowered. It's like saying a Devil is much more overpowered than an Imp. True it's more powerful, but it costs more!
That's why marksmen are not overpowered in my humble opinion. LOTS of marksmen are overpowered, as are lots of master hunters or Arch devils.. However, because only Haven has training, then it's fair to say "training" is overpowered, not marksmen.. 
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted January 05, 2007 07:30 PM |
|
|
Quote:
I don't know what maps you play, but without gold mines even I have some problems with the Gold. Imagine with Training.
You play rich maps? I can make a map where you have 6 Gold mines for each player, and Haven will rule. That's it. It really depends on the map.
Oh yeah, Haven sucks at creeping because the first units are so slow...
You wrote in the other topic that you always (almost) take exp from chests. Well, this is the answer. Don't waste money on exp and enjoy the power of training. Easy
|
|
|
|
This thread is pages long: 
