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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted August 26, 2010 12:58 PM |
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I don't like the idea of heroes on the battlefield but if a hero can attack and cast spells then he must be punishable for this. So I propose the checkmate system like that in chess game. I think that creatures can kill heroes BUT if your hero is in danger (check) you are FORCED to defend him otherwise you LOOSE!
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted August 26, 2010 01:05 PM |
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that sounds weird to me. How shall it work exactly?
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted August 26, 2010 01:19 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 13:21, 26 Aug 2010.
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Your army should consist of attackers and defenders. Attackers do their job - eliminating enemy troops and trying to kill the opponent's hero while defenders must defend their own hero from enemy attackers. If your hero isn't protected by defenders and enemy creature can hit him then you loose (provided that now is not your turn). If any enemy creature can hit your hero but it is your turn you must protect your hero otherwise he'll die the next turn.
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted August 26, 2010 01:31 PM |
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That is too far from HoMM for me
How should I name the poitn, however? Chess-like battles. Also, it would be awesome if you told us hwo you like the points allready mentioned! 
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted August 26, 2010 01:55 PM |
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'Chess-like battles' sounds. If implemented well, it might add new tactics and fun to the game. You will be able to win not just by eliminating all enemy troops, but also by killing the opponent's 'king'.
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted August 26, 2010 01:59 PM |
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Yeah it could be good. I change my to a  ^^
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 27, 2010 12:42 AM |
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Edited by Fauch at 00:57, 27 Aug 2010.
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Quote:
True, when I say "kill" it's because for me, the core element of Heroes games have always been minimizing your losses through planning the appropriate attack order so that you take out stacks before they take you out - and you can't do that in the same way with simultanous retaliations
it wasn't hard to avoid retaliations in H4 :
life don't have much counters but you can just use guardian angel or resurection
with order, you can use song of peace, hypnotize, blind... nagas have no retalations, dragon golems have first strike
with nature, mantis have first strike, unicorns may blind, you can use wasp swarm
with death you can use aura of fear, terror... cerberi have no retaliation, dragons have fear
with stronghold, you have harpies, though it isn't much
with chaos you have nightmares with terror, hydras with no retaliation, confusion, cloud of confusion
chess like battle : the hero could have HPs (a few hundreds to a few thousands) so if he takes a few hits he dies. kind of a mix of the H4 and H5 systems. but in H4 you could fight without heroes, but you lost some advantages, like tactics, the artifacts, etc...
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Warlord
Famous Hero
Lord of Image Spam
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posted August 27, 2010 02:16 AM |
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More options in the tavern. Drinking to improve morale, meeting people from other factions for diplomacy hiring unique units, etc.
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JonsJons
Tavern Dweller
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posted August 27, 2010 04:28 AM |
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speaking of tavern, they should have neutral alignment heroes and allow them to be hired there but at a slightly higher cost
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted August 27, 2010 08:46 AM |
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Quote:
'Chess-like battles' sounds. If implemented well, it might add new tactics and fun to the game. You will be able to win not just by eliminating all enemy troops, but also by killing the opponent's 'king'.
I'm still against this idea.
Reason? Because I think it makes it too easy to exploit. If your facing an enemy army you can't eliminate, you put all forces to eliminate the Hero and get an easy win.
However, I am for Heroes on battlefield Heroes 4 style. I just think Hero needs to have many more hit points, so that killing the Hero is not a general option. If Hero has, say, Level x 1000 HP, he'll be pretty tough. Also, if Hero should get killed, army is not downright defeated, although obviously some advantages would be lost.
So what would it benefit to have Hero on battlefield:
- More direct-attack options, such as range of attack and manners of attack (ranged, melee, mounted)
- Option to implement range for spells, so that AOE spells will affect creatures within a certain distance of Hero, making tactical placement important
- Hero vs. Hero options
____________
What will happen now?
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted August 27, 2010 10:30 AM |
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What about chess-like DUELS?
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted August 27, 2010 11:42 AM |
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Quote:
chess like battle : the hero could have HPs (a few hundreds to a few thousands) so if he takes a few hits he dies. kind of a mix of the H4 and H5 systems. but in H4 you could fight without heroes, but you lost some advantages, like tactics, the artifacts, etc...
? With a few thousand hp it woudl take qutie MANY hitpoints. Also I don'T see where your point is...
Quote:
More options in the tavern. Drinking to improve morale, meeting people from other factions for diplomacy hiring unique units, etc.
THe first maybe, but the others should have their own buildings. I also think the thieves guild should again be seperated from tavern, honestly...
Quote:
speaking of tavern, they should have neutral alignment heroes and allow them to be hired there but at a slightly higher cost
We had that partly allready: Quote:
-New hero classes unconnected to towns
I also think they should be hireable in towns but that is detail. I hnestly donÄt think they should be more expensive - they could have no racials!
Quote:
However, I am for Heroes on battlefield Heroes 4 style. I just think Hero needs to have many more hit points, so that killing the Hero is not a general option. If Hero has, say, Level x 1000 HP, he'll be pretty tough. Also, if Hero should get killed, army is not downright defeated, although obviously some advantages would be lost.
I'm neutral to it, but it would ahve to be REALLY good implemented. also, the advance shouldn't be so much...in H4 your Lvl 1 hero was mostly crap and dead by one it almost...and your High level hero would sometimes not need an army anymore to defeat a recognizable stack of L4-creatures. That, I would dislike!
Quote:
So what would it benefit to have Hero on battlefield:
- More direct-attack options, such as range of attack and manners of attack (ranged, melee, mounted)
- Option to implement range for spells, so that AOE spells will affect creatures within a certain distance of Hero, making tactical placement important
- Hero vs. Hero options
1: could be done with hereo off battlefield partly
2: hmmm not sure.
3: I would want a special hero-duel option for that!
Also the first point reminds me of something:
Heroe sin abttle or not I'd like different mounts - not only for the classes. It would work like this:
1. hero has no mount
2. you can buy him a mount in the town buildings: a riding mount, a battle mount & a flying mount.
...of course it would make MUCH more since with heroes in battle like in H4^^
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 27, 2010 03:30 PM |
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alc : would we have to defeat the hero in order to win, or just his army?
and could you have several heroes in an army?
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted August 27, 2010 03:52 PM |
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...we could add all these options in the main list^^
like
-Hero on battlefield (hero msut die)
-Hero on Batlefield (army must die)
-multiple heroes in one army + fighting on battlefield
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serptico
Adventuring Hero
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posted August 27, 2010 04:45 PM |
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Placing range units on towers
One of my many wishes is the return on being able to place a stack of ranged units on towers. No limits, I know that the value of ranged units will peak and it will create unbalance. But, the flip side would be that if the tower gets destroyed, so will your ranged units even if you had 1000 of them stacked up on it.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted August 27, 2010 07:04 PM |
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Quote:
alc : would we have to defeat the hero in order to win, or just his army?
and could you have several heroes in an army?
No, there was obviously a point that needed to be elaborated:
1) You need to defeat only the Hero's army to win combat (Heroes 1-2-3-5 style).
Which also means:
2) A hero cannot fight on with no creatures left.
Thus, you could give the Hero infinite HP if you wanted, but still place him on the battlefield - the point would be that he actually has a position which means there are tactical elements relevant for consideration.
Obviously, unlimited HP would create the opportunity to use Hero as an obstacle which would have to be circumvented somehow ...
____________
What will happen now?
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted August 27, 2010 07:57 PM |
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Quote:
Obviously, unlimited HP would create the opportunity to use Hero as an obstacle which would have to be circumvented somehow ...
maybe the hero steps aside when an enemy needs the place?
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted August 27, 2010 08:13 PM |
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Yes, something like that, can't come up with a flawless solution right on the spot, but I'm sure one could work it out.
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What will happen now?
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bludgeon
Known Hero
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posted August 27, 2010 10:15 PM |
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Big thumbs up for the idea of switchable mounts that provide various benefits. 
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 28, 2010 01:34 AM |
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would there be a line of sight penalty like in H4? like you can't cast a spell if you don't see the target?
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This thread is pages long: 
