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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 01, 2013 06:52 PM |
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Was just answering a question about what would make sense, not what would be balanced in game terms. 
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 01, 2013 07:53 PM |
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I actually think that some of the things that made the factions unique, like Barbarians not being good at magic, was lost with the two-hero system.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted January 01, 2013 09:12 PM |
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Quote:
I actually think that some of the things that made the factions unique, like Barbarians not being good at magic, was lost with the two-hero system.
On the other hand, single class heroes/faction can lead to very frustating situations... I still have nightmares with those Demon Lords with 10-30 quite wasted knowledge
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted January 01, 2013 10:31 PM |
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That was HV mistake to:
a) restricted max hero level to 40th,
b) always gives the same stats for heroes.
In previous games heroes got their class stats only on levels 1-10, later they had greater chance to got another stats and of course they could gain more then merely 40 levels.
Also you could easy rise for example Barbarian's Knowledge or Spell Power by artifacts, which were quite powerful and easy obtained.
And if none from these ways were good to you, you could always hire hero from other facion and you didn't have any disadvantages from that like in HV and in HVI.
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted January 02, 2013 08:41 AM |
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Yes, and that is why I've always said that hero development-wise Heroes V was much more restricting than Heroes III and the total number of viable builds was small (and I'm not talking about balance here - taking the balance into account reduces that number even further). Some people seem to disagree for unknown reasons.
As for the level cap - level 40 was unreachable in 99% of the single-player and 100% of the multi-player games anyway.
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted January 02, 2013 12:04 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 12:10, 02 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
As for the level cap - level 40 was unreachable in 99% of the single-player and 100% of the multi-player games anyway.
Whereas in Heroes VI the 30 lvl limit is quite restricting (especially when you have sub-quests to complete)
Sigh... I still remember my lvl 80 Adrienne in Playing with Fire...
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 02, 2013 12:24 PM |
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I actually have no idea what you are talking about.
Heroes V hero development follows largely Heroes III, although with only 1 hero type per faction. There are percentage probabilities fpr primary and secondary skills for primary skills and secondary skills - you can read that in the ToTe Fan Manual, starting page 293.
A Knight for example, has probabilities 30% Attack, 45% Defense, 10% Spell Power and 15% Knowledge.
For Secondaries, said Knight has 15% in both Leadership and Defense, 10% in Racial, War Machines and Attack, and so on.
That means, you could have quite different Knights in primary stats and secondaries as well, albeit there was a tendency.
In Heroes VI, what has been "secondary skill" is freely pickable, while the primary attributes are completely fixed: ALL heroes of a certain class, Haven Might, for example, will develop ALWAYS equally, that is, you'lle get the same primary attributes every time, so all Haven Might Heroes sans their artifacts and secondaries will ALWAYS look the same.
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted January 02, 2013 01:07 PM |
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There are so many nonsenses and fallacies in your post that it's not even worth an answer.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 02, 2013 01:30 PM |
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Not the first time you demonstrate complete cluelessness. I really wonder what your problem is - inability to read, maybe?
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted January 02, 2013 02:34 PM |
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I think we all need a vacation 
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted January 02, 2013 04:14 PM |
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Edited by Avonu at 16:15, 02 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
I actually have no idea what you are talking about.
Take a dictionary to your hand and look at: (primaly) stat(istic), skill and ability and find the diference.
We were talking about stats, not skills and abilities.
Quote:
Heroes V hero development follows largely Heroes III, although with only 1 hero type per faction.
1. Heroes 2-3 have 8 skills, not five as HV. Yes in HoMM 2-3 you have 1-2 skills which are prefered by hero class but other classes can learn it too. In HV-HVI race/faction skills can't be learn by other hero classes and don't work with other faction OR neutral armies.
Also in H1-4 you could choose hero from other faction and you haven't any disadvantages for that. Now, not only you have -2 Morale in HV but tell me, how these "new" racial/faction skills will benefit neutrals or other factions?
Can I rise dead with my Necromancer in Warlock army? Can Paladin use Guarding Angel on Light Elemetals or Wolves (they are lore wise units for Haven after all)? Can Demon Lord/Heretic summon demons when (s)he is hired by Necromancers? Necromancers, Warlocks, Druids, Summoners and others class could do that in H2-4 (especially in H4).
Quote:
There are percentage probabilities fpr primary and secondary skills for primary skills and secondary skills - you can read that in the ToTe Fan Manual, starting page 293.
These percent chances work on paper but not in game. In-game skill and ability mechanism is somehow broken and you can end with choise between the same 2 abilities 3 times at row. Also, 2% chance skill will pop-up at least once during a game, so it is not really random but programed at game/map start and all skills are available for player (just some will pop-up only 1-2 times and anothers several times).
Quote:
In Heroes VI, what has been "secondary skill" is freely pickable, while the primary attributes are completely fixed: ALL heroes of a certain class, Haven Might, for example, will develop ALWAYS equally, that is, you'lle get the same primary attributes every time, so all Haven Might Heroes sans their artifacts and secondaries will ALWAYS look the same.
You wanted to say: They will always look the same especially with skills.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted January 02, 2013 06:50 PM |
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Quote:
That was HV mistake to:
a) restricted max hero level to 40th,
b) always gives the same stats for heroes.
In previous games heroes got their class stats only on levels 1-10, later they had greater chance to got another stats and of course they could gain more then merely 40 levels.
Also you could easy rise for example Barbarian's Knowledge or Spell Power by artifacts, which were quite powerful and easy obtained.
And if none from these ways were good to you, you could always hire hero from other facion and you didn't have any disadvantages from that like in HV and in HVI.
That's true.
Quote:
Quote:
Heroes V hero development follows largely Heroes III, although with only 1 hero type per faction.
1. Heroes 2-3 have 8 skills, not five as HV. Yes in HoMM 2-3 you have 1-2 skills which are prefered by hero class but other classes can learn it too. In HV-HVI race/faction skills can't be learn by other hero classes and don't work with other faction OR neutral armies.
Also in H1-4 you could choose hero from other faction and you haven't any disadvantages for that. Now, not only you have -2 Morale in HV but tell me, how these "new" racial/faction skills will benefit neutrals or other factions?
Can I rise dead with my Necromancer in Warlock army? Can Paladin use Guarding Angel on Light Elemetals or Wolves (they are lore wise units for Haven after all)? Can Demon Lord/Heretic summon demons when (s)he is hired by Necromancers? Necromancers, Warlocks, Druids, Summoners and others class could do that in H2-4 (especially in H4).
THIS is something I missed a lot when playing HV, and I guess it's a similar situation in HVI. Racials killed army mixing
I really hope they try to leave some room for mixing armies in HVII...
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Vindicator
Supreme Hero
Right Back Extraordinaire
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posted January 02, 2013 06:54 PM |
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All right, now that artwork just looks plain bad. It goes from being a normal creature to just pure purple, it's really awful. Not enough purple on the normal manticore (there should be a few hints of it, imo, or it won't look cohesive with the rest of the faction) and way, way too much on the upgrade. Scorpiore? Is that really the best you could come up with, Ubisoft? I am disappointed. 
I mean this, btw. 
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 02, 2013 06:54 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
I actually have no idea what you are talking about.
Take a dictionary to your hand and look at: (primaly) stat(istic), skill and ability and find the diference.
We were talking about stats, not skills and abilities.
Exactly the point: stat-wise H VI is the first Heroes game all Heroes of the same class will look EXACTLY the same. Not so in all the others. Nothing to discuss there. So stop barking.
Quote:
Heroes V hero development follows largely Heroes III, although with only 1 hero type per faction.
1. Heroes 2-3 have 8 skills, not five as HV. Yes in HoMM 2-3 you have 1-2 skills which are prefered by hero class but other classes can learn it too. In HV-HVI race/faction skills can't be learn by other hero classes and don't work with other faction OR neutral armiesAlso in H1-4 you could choose hero from other faction and you haven't any disadvantages for that. Now, not only you have -2 Morale in HV but tell me, how these "new" racial/faction skills will benefit neutrals or other factions?
Can I rise dead with my Necromancer in Warlock army? Can Paladin use Guarding Angel on Light Elemetals or Wolves (they are lore wise units for Haven after all)? Can Demon Lord/Heretic summon demons when (s)he is hired by Necromancers? Necromancers, Warlocks, Druids, Summoners and others class could do that in H2-4 (especially in H4)..
Which is EXACTLY the way it SHOULD be. Nothing to discuss there either. Look at Heroes II if you want a lecture of how things get out of hand when you can actually use all heroes for all factions.
Of course - using a Dungeon hero as high-magic-damage-dealer works for every faction, so that wasn't foolproof. H VI does a better job there.
Quote:
Quote:
There are percentage probabilities fpr primary and secondary skills for primary skills and secondary skills - you can read that in the ToTe Fan Manual, starting page 293.
These percent chances work on paper but not in game. In-game skill and ability mechanism is somehow broken and you can end with choise between the same 2 abilities 3 times at row. Also, 2% chance skill will pop-up at least once during a game, so it is not really random but programed at game/map start and all skills are available for player (just some will pop-up only 1-2 times and anothers several times).
No, they work in game also - you just have to pick your skills and abilities WISELY, if you want to avoid that kind of problem.
Quote:
Quote:
In Heroes VI, what has been "secondary skill" is freely pickable, while the primary attributes are completely fixed: ALL heroes of a certain class, Haven Might, for example, will develop ALWAYS equally, that is, you'lle get the same primary attributes every time, so all Haven Might Heroes sans their artifacts and secondaries will ALWAYS look the same.
You wanted to say: They will always look the same especially with skills.
That's a problem as well, but not the point I was making - which is why I don't understand what you are all talking about.
NONE of the 6 Heroes games did it completely satisfactory.
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 02, 2013 06:55 PM |
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is it just me or does the unupgraded Dungeon creatures generally look better than the upgrades so far? the upgraded Manticore is just so overdone in blue/purple
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted January 02, 2013 06:58 PM |
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Too much purple on the upgrades, it's becoming really boring....minotaurs and scorpicories didn't need to be purple, looks stupid T_T
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 02, 2013 07:01 PM |
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yup first thing I'm gonna do when the game comes out, is recoloring them all x)
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted January 02, 2013 07:12 PM |
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Well, if the trend goes on and dragons are in the lineup, they'd be Purple Dragons....meh
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GunFred
Supreme Hero
Sexy Manticore
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posted January 02, 2013 07:29 PM |
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The appearance itself is very good with both manticore and minotaur but like you guys, I think the upgrades are too dark and purple. Hope fully the ingame models will be toned down a bit.
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gnomes2169
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Duke of the Glade
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posted January 02, 2013 09:03 PM |
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Quote:
Scorpiore? Is that really the best you could come up with, Ubisoft? I am disappointed.
*Cough*It's a shout out to the H3 dungeon creature*/cough*
Other than that, they really did overdo it with the purple. It makes me think of a jolley rancher or an ice sculpture in the winter festivals more than a living creature.
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Yeah in the 18th century, two inventions suggested a method of measurement. One won and the other stayed in America.
-Ghost destroying Fred
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