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| Thread: Donald Trump recognizes AlQods as Israel’s capital city |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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fred79
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posted December 31, 2017 12:15 PM |
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Edited by fred79 at 12:18, 31 Dec 2017.
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artu said:
It is a very well-known fact that traditionally, Judaism wasn't exactly welcoming to newcomers with open arms. Don't get me wrong, as a non-religious person, I actually prefer it to the expansionist mind set of crusades or jihad, nothing as annoying as someone trying to convert you, especially if they're holding a sword.
this isn't my personal opinion, but:
from the seperate boards on 4chan that dislike each other and have largely differing viewpoints, and that constantly war with one another, they all agree on one thing: that judaism's goal isn't conversion through belief, but domination via control of cash flow and by using the media to push their agenda(which they claim is to create upheaval and "degeneration" within opposing societies). i don't know how much of it is factual, but there seem to be a myriad of points to prove this. from what they say among each other and with countless infographics(of which i'm curious to know if true or not), that despite being such a small demographic globally, they account for the majority of both the rich, and those who control western culture through media. if it's true that most of the ceo's and executives from hollywood and from every media conglomerate are jewish, then they might actually be correct. likewise for their claim that the banks are largely jewish run/controlled.
again, this is from ALL the boards at 4chan. these guys get at each other's throats(pro-anti this and that), on pretty much every other topic. but with judaism, they seem to combine like voltron. it's curious to note, that with such a hateful and divided group of people, they all have the same view of judaism.
now, before anyone says "consider the source, fred", i'll repeat, that the above isn't my viewpoint. i don't think it's the jews specifically, but i DO know that it's the rich that control pretty much everything. at least THAT is undebatable; since THAT undeniable proof is everywhere.
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JollyJoker
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posted December 31, 2017 12:45 PM |
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There comes a point, eventually, when realities have to be recognized as such. The "Arab" world has made enough violent efforts to "undo" Israel, and you can fail only so often in an attempt before it amounts to insanity not to recognize the obvious.
So the part of the Arab nations that doesn't recognize Israel is just denying stubbornly the political and military realities here and have wasted decades of chances and opportunities to salvage something out of what may seem a mess for them - at the expense of the Palestinians.
So we have two different problems here. ONE is the fact that a stubborn group of reality-denying states is blocking progress and all negotions for everyone including the Palestinians and their situation, by not recognizing Israel and its right to exist (there is no negotiation possible if one side doesn't recognize your most basic right - in that case there can only be (cold) war).
ANOTHER is the situation of Jerusalem, wich is basically of problem of Israel AND the Palestinians. If a country isn't recognizing another's right to exist, then whatever capital the latter has, doesn't change much. Which means, pressing on the Jerusalem issue means hitting on the weakest side here, and that's the Palestinensians.
Meaning, making Jerusalem capital doesn't help Israel IN ANY WAY.
A much more significant way to try and "force" the issue would be a harder stance against those countries that do not recognize the state of Israel, although there has to be said that there is a difference between accepting A state of Israel and THE (existing) state of Israel, meaning, you may accept there is a state of Israel, but its actual borders may still be an object of discussion.
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Geny
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posted December 31, 2017 12:58 PM |
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Quote:
Meaning, making Jerusalem capital doesn't help Israel IN ANY WAY.
If you'll go to the beginning of the thread you'll see that I was the first one to say that. I also said that it will cause a lot of bloodshed and for a change was pleasantly surprised. But when I thought it was over we flipped the coin and everyone decided to push against the declaration not letting it die, even though I still think that the issue is at this point at least meaningless and even somewhat absurd.
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antipaladin
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posted December 31, 2017 12:59 PM |
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Not more then the usa or aligir. By that logic i proclaim washington as the state of crusaders of anti religius fanatics wih burn all temples not dedicated to a new religion the cult of baa , and claim usa as counqeueres and evil dictators to us baa'ist. Silly isent it? When its your home its not okay joker,isent that a bit hippocritticle ?
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JollyJoker
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posted December 31, 2017 01:44 PM |
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No, that's silly nonsense.
As I said, the existence of Israel as such should be out of any dispute by now (as that of the US). That doesn't mean, however, that a country with strong ties to the Native Americans (which doesn't exist), might not accept the current territories/reservations alocated to the Native Americans and try to negotiate/pressure the US into being more considerate. Conversely, after the US/mexican war, Mexico conceded territory to the US, sealed by treaty. It doesn't make sense to start and doubt those treaties.
Situation with Israel is comparable. It survivd everything, and what can be point of discussion or negotiation is everything not finally settled. What IS finally settled is that there is a state of Israel. Its eventual borders, though, are not, as are the status of the "Natives", Jerusalem, and so on.
Not recognizing Israel is effectively blocking everything here, but Jerusalem has nothing to do with that.
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antipaladin
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posted December 31, 2017 01:50 PM |
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How is jerusalem differs from washingtone d.c? I demand you surrender dc to the indians and move your capitol to new york where it belongs...how is hat diffrent?
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JollyJoker
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posted December 31, 2017 02:39 PM |
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antipaladin
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posted December 31, 2017 08:15 PM |
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I dissagree. 
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JollyJoker
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posted December 31, 2017 08:50 PM |
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See, that's the attitude that blocked progress over the last 70 years: I disagree. OF COURSE there is disagreement. But you have to look for things you AGREE about when you want to progress.
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AlHazin
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النور
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posted December 31, 2017 11:59 PM |
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antipaladin said:
So by your logic i can not recogonize the soverign state of algir and as part of france and get away with it? I do see hippocreasy wih you siding oboiusly the palastinian side. What about israely muslim arabs who enjoy life in israel? You know that atleast 40% of them reicves better financial stability thwn none muslim israelys and by extend more then half of the arabic world. This could never happen if "palastine" would exist
But you and I have nothing to recognize, it is states that recognize other states, official institutions recognizing official institutions. Individuals don't have any official status to do so.
Also hypocrisy is actually about not really siding with anyone. When you choose a side you're by definition not hypocrite in the situation. To be honest, it's not a matter of Palestinians, it's a matter of justice, and AlQods, or Jerujeru if you prefer. Not fighting for people but for ideologies.
And this is why the situation is still what it is and will remain problematic, Palestinians or Arabs mixed with the Jews, it is harder to distinguish between the twi sides today. I know of muslims who fight in tsahal and Jews who are against occupying the holy land. Under the French colonisation we never mixed with the French and that was the key element into driving them out. Driving the "Jews" out of Palestine doesn't really have much meaning today.
What is sure is that peace is not an option. The situation will remain pretty much what it is, until it collapses if it ever does. According to the prophecy it will at some point, but artu doubts my prophecies generally.
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artu
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My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted January 01, 2018 12:31 AM |
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AlHazin said:
Also hypocrisy is actually about not really siding with anyone.
No, hypocrisy is inconsistency between your statements and your actions. Not siding with anyone is simply being impartial. And seeing how both sides have religious claims that are by default irrational and inflexible, staying impartial is actually quite a sensible thing to do.
If you put aside historical claims or religious prophicies of which everybody will insist on their own and which dont mean crap in the world of reelpolitik though, one thing is certain, had such conflict been resolved, muslim or jew, people are more free, wealthier and happier under the state of Israel than they have ever been under any Islamic State (which Palastine will surely turn into.) So there's really not much of a thing on the Muslim side to support when all it can potentially achieve will be another tyranny in poverty that will turn most of its citizens into immigrants who hate life in their own country.
Also, holding onto prophicies while making political analysis in 2017 2018 or idealizing how muslims should never mix with other cultures are both perfect examples of why and how Islamic culture dried out and turned into an anachronic zombie, how its education is FUBAR, and why nobody would actually care if it goes extinct.
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AlHazin
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النور
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posted January 01, 2018 12:40 AM |
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Ah artu I like when you take your opinions for facts and your hopes for reality.
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Nothing of value disappears from this world, it will reappear in some shape or form ^^ - Elvin
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artu
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My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted January 01, 2018 12:54 AM |
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They are more factual than your "prophecy." You can easily bet on that.
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fred79
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posted January 01, 2018 01:05 AM |
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is this what they call a flame war?
count me in! i can be just as flaming as anybody!
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artu
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My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted January 01, 2018 01:08 AM |
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Lol, it's no flame war, fred.
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fred79
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posted January 01, 2018 04:35 AM |
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well, shoot. i got all gussied up for nothing.
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artu
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My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted January 01, 2018 05:03 AM |
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Stop making excuses to stay in touch with your feminine side, fred.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
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posted January 01, 2018 07:30 AM |
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you see right through me, artu. 
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antipaladin
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posted January 01, 2018 10:21 AM |
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JollyJoker said:
See, that's the attitude that blocked progress over the last 70 years: I disagree. OF COURSE there is disagreement. But you have to look for things you AGREE about when you want to progress.
Well why wont you then agree with me? Why wont agree that washungtone shouldnt be americsn capitol
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JollyJoker
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posted January 01, 2018 10:32 AM |
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I don't care about which town is the capital of which country. And I don't even care about what Jerusalem will or won't become. What I care about is the president of the currently most powerful country in the world makes lonely decisions that put yet more oil into the flames raging far too long in that region. There ARE already a couple of wars going on, after all.
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