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| Thread: -------> New Map:: Genesis <---------- |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted August 19, 2008 12:57 AM |
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Quote:
Now lets get this post back on track... now that Genesis-v1.0 is posted I am waiting for some serious feedback. And some more discussion about Jhora and Deleb... still might put them back in once I hear some more debate on them 
Jhora at lvl 30 has initiative of 11.5 or 15% more than competitors. Sorcery has actually a little smaller absolute effect for Jhora than normally which is connected with game mechanics. IMO creature specialists and some others have larger impact on game than 1 more cast for Jhora in 10 turns.
Deleb used to be banned because of fireballed ballista starting from lvl1 and dmg formula back then was several times stronger. Now she is a bit better w/m hero. Her main advantage is 2 levels in w/m right away and thus safer and faster creeping.
Also, I suggest that some very active advisers keep voice a bit down. Jinxer will never implement your suggestions if they are advocated in this fashion.  Whatever is my or other's opinion, mapmaker still possesses a decisive vote. But most of all, let's not forger to add some appreciation for this succesful project among all the criticizm 
About money... right now we are close to ending game and i'm swimming in money as dwarfs. Perhaps I'm just having a lucky game... Also, I mostly agree with Jinxer about necro.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 19, 2008 01:43 AM |
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wow... I think your having a lucky game.. either that or you took 2nd town and gold mine really super early... IN my last couple games... I had to trade off every last unused artifact and some resources in week 7 just to make my upgrades... and when fought in final battle as Fiur was racing toward my town.. I had 245 gold 
Ofcourse I didnt have time to make it to Sunken temple either.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 19, 2008 01:51 AM |
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Quote:
In German community I barely know anybody who played Hourglass more than once or twice, Battlezone however was played very often, and it seems that Genesis will too.
Cool! Seems Germans have good taste
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Elit
Famous Hero
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posted August 19, 2008 09:45 AM |
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Quote:
PS: In German community I barely know anybody who played Hourglass more than once or twice, Battlezone however was played very often, and it seems that Genesis will too.
You are very active in HC. Why you and all your frends from German community not join in ToH? More players more drama and fun
About maps. Its not HG vs BZ. I just try to say how very well desing map can be killed from so many BAD balances.
Look simple facts
From all emperors games:
1.Hourglas 343 games total
2.RatRace 72 games total and its very young map.
3.BattleZone 37 games total
4.Dueblo 35 games total.
From all Lords games:
1.Hourglas: 361 games total.
2.RatRace 143 games total.
3.Dueblo 84 games total.
4.BattleZone: 31 games total
I'm lazy to make more stats from other maps. Most games on BZ are on early version on maps. So can you tell me why none play more BZ when its "perfect balanced map".
I will tell it again. BZ and Genesis are VERY WELL DESING MAPS. Can be top played maps if Jinxer learn to not kill them with his "balance".
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Fraudatio
Famous Hero
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posted August 19, 2008 10:08 PM |
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Elit said: Quote:
If you cant understand it i will not make more comments about your maps.
Please me a man of words, as your reasoning doesnt make sense at all when you are using numbers on small vs large maps etc. Abusing statistics like that makes my econometric heart ache
You think nothing should be "balanced" my mapmakers, thats an honourable view. As is Jinxers. Why take it further, must one be wrong? There is no official answer to every question asked, as some may think. In most democracies we can live with different religions, different taste of soap operas, it would be amazing if we could accept different views on balance in ToH without trying to "prove" once supreme correct insight.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 20, 2008 05:42 AM |
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Edited by Jinxer at 18:30, 20 Aug 2008.
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OKay... I am getting ready to post Genesis-v1.1 update...
Here are the changes:
- Fixed free access to relic in Northern passage (didnt have to fight one of the Inferno Garrisons to get relic - I am sure noone was dishonest and abused this )
- Back by popular Request.. Jhora and Deleb can now play in Genesis too So now there is only 3 banned heroes. Wyngaal-Haggash-Urghat. If I am willing to compromise I am sure others can too
- Fixed the Angel Garrison... Not all stacks would fit.
- Tried to fix the caravan blockage for teal and green again.
- ***** Still debating on weather to leave Ring and Staff in... already heard horror story from someone that Acadamy had UNGODLY initiative and all thre units moved 2-3 times every round to his one... Thats main reason I left it out in first place... with staff and ring in... Acadamy becomes way to strong sigh... Still thinking....*******
- Put DivineVengance in based on Patch3.1 -- Hope UBI wasnt drunk this time and actually fixed it.
- Fixed the free access Relic in Greens sand area. Thanks Kisp
Before I post it... gonna wait till tomorrow to make sure there isnt any other bugs or issues that need addressed that I mighta missed.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted August 20, 2008 04:27 PM |
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Also take a look in the new patch changes, apparently there were undocumented ones. Some are posted here, for instance it seems that rage was nerfed but I'm not sure by how much. Also there's the matter of DV. If it has been sufficiently nerfed then there is no reason why it should remain banned.
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Map also hosted on Moddb
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Kispagat
Famous Hero
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posted August 20, 2008 04:40 PM |
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I have realized that the relic after beating haven and infreno guard for green player can be reached without defeating inferno guards.
Caravan now from lvl 1 blocks the way for green from ssecond wood mine.
Also there is a relic in the pyramid-sphinx area, can be stealed without defeating lvl 7-s.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 20, 2008 05:41 PM |
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thanks Kisp... I will add those fixed to the 1.1 update..
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted August 20, 2008 05:59 PM |
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I noticed that in the sea those whirlpools don't work in the presumably intended way. Namely, ship get transferred to another RANDOM wirlpool - be it in the middle or right away to the other garrison.
Anyway, it's not that important...
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 20, 2008 06:24 PM |
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Edited by Jinxer at 18:32, 20 Aug 2008.
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On the contrary Strider... they work exactly as I designed them too.. Kinda like the 2 way portals just have to pop around til you get the one you want That is a much faster way to opponent.. So must be some risk involved... Also I wanted it to be slightly tuffer to get to memory mentor. Only to be used if you Truely Truely NEED it... Not for people to hit every witch hut every game and easily exploit it Besides some players may not want the mentor and wanna just run straight to opponent... so if they get lucky and land on opponent whirlpool first they wouldnt have to pass thru 3 whirlpools to get there.
But thanks for observation
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted August 20, 2008 06:38 PM |
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All right then. Btw, I was referring to version 0.9 (no mentor) - there the 2 middle whirlpools had almost no other purpose besides being extra destination places to slow down the ship as I managed to jump straight away to other garrison.
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted August 20, 2008 10:59 PM |
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So you removed a 2nd lvl dwelling and probably that's good - 2nd lvl creature specialists are not empowered any more. But there are still 2 first lvl dwellings. Doesn't it make superheroes Ingvar and Havez relatively more frightening Or maybe you just wanted to even out number for all 1-4 lvl dwellings on the map?
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Vangelis21
Supreme Hero
Manchild
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posted August 21, 2008 05:57 PM |
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guys which is the strongest garisson and anyone can suggest ways to beat it more easily?
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Heroes VI is here and Necropolis is serious trouble!
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 22, 2008 06:12 PM |
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Edited by Jinxer at 18:18, 22 Aug 2008.
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Still waiting to hear some feed back on the new patch before I post the Genesis-v1.1 verison... anyone tested Divine... is it fixed? Decent?
Also I am open to suggestions on how to balance Acadamy better... I am working on some ideas.. but willing to hear any other ideas before I post the new verison.
As it is.. With there mini arts... they intitative is just way outtacontrol and quite silly. And since everyone wanted speed ring and Staff on map... that could make acadamy untouchable. Please.. NO Flaming.. just serious discussion and ideas.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted August 22, 2008 07:05 PM |
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This says a few things about DV. I personally think it's better that it remains banned. And yes academy can be pretty fast but not overpoweringly so, for that it needs archer's dream Personally I am against the use of so powerful initiative artifacts in maps that you can gather so powerful armies - Oops unlucky, maybe that won't happen again if you play another 6 weeks game 
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted August 22, 2008 07:15 PM |
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Unfortunately, nerfing of DV is by far insufficient. It still deals ~1.5 times more dmg than implosion. Make your own conclusions...
About Academy... Nothing to do here - you have kept precious resource mines almost to minimum. Perhaps resource piles could be reduced But in general, that extra initiative is compensated by substantially lower attack/defence. If this compensation looks negligible against some races, then opponent should rush in order to avoid mini-art madness.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted August 22, 2008 08:46 PM |
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If UBI was able to make a balanced game.. then all towns could compete no matter what the week... But having some towns ubeatable in early game if you rush and other towns unbeatable in late game if you dont rush... its quite silly. I dont mind some uneveness for spice... but to say that well you showed up 1 week to late so now we are gonna BOOST this town outta reach so you cannot beat them... come on.
Anyways... I think I will start with striders idea .. which was kinda what I was thinking and reduce the loose resources some...
Have also noticed that not all TOWN specialties are crazy... Just Acadamy and Orcs... And to be honest if they nerfed the initative mini arts in Acadamy they wouldnt be as bad... I dont care about any of the other mini arts... But to grant Acadamy 40% boost to there initative on TOP of any other initative boost they have is plain SILLY! Wish I could come up with a different word then SILLY.. but that one fits. hehe
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fiur
Promising
Supreme Hero
Map Creator
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posted August 22, 2008 09:08 PM |
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Quote:
If UBI was able to make a balanced game.. then all towns could compete no matter what the week... But having some towns ubeatable in early game if you rush and other towns unbeatable in late game if you dont rush... its quite silly. I dont mind some uneveness for spice... but to say that well you showed up 1 week to late so now we are gonna BOOST this town outta reach so you cannot beat them... come on.
Anyways... I think I will start with striders idea .. which was kinda what I was thinking and reduce the loose resources some...
Have also noticed that not all TOWN specialties are crazy... Just Acadamy and Orcs... And to be honest if they nerfed the initative mini arts in Acadamy they wouldnt be as bad... I dont care about any of the other mini arts... But to grant Acadamy 40% boost to there initative on TOP of any other initative boost they have is plain SILLY! Wish I could come up with a different word then SILLY.. but that one fits. hehe
I would call it madness...
but there is severeal other strong elements.. like you got 150 Arcane Archers.. with a luck hit + fav. enemie hit... jist wow...
then you got late game dwarfs... again just wow...
but for sure strongest is Academy... with (around 60% init boost if lucky) 3*wow
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infinitus
Supreme Hero
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posted August 22, 2008 10:00 PM |
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"Unfortunately, nerfing of DV is by far insufficient. It still deals ~1.5 times more dmg than implosion. Make your own conclusions..."
DV it's okay this way, implosion can be used from the beginning of combat on any unit... DV it's good only against units with frags, so DV have more limited usage but more powerful ...
I think DV can contribute to balance match ups like Sylvan-Orcs, Sylvan-Sylvan etc ... Example - Wyngaal archers shoot first, all Ossir archers dead, but Ossir DV coming next...
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Nothing's impossible
http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=loCSLJ6IodY
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