|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
posted July 19, 2007 08:54 AM |
|
|
|
one.. and the rest slaughters you : (
|
|
sdfx
Famous Hero
|
|
posted July 19, 2007 11:40 AM |
|
|
Even if AI split can be predicted/countered there is still a chance that random obstacles will be placed all wrong.
With no dark(confusion) or summoning(fire warriors) or war machines(tent) it's going to hurt.
____________
|
|
Sanyu
Known Hero
|
|
posted July 19, 2007 02:45 PM |
|
|
Somehow I've been using the cerebi tactics for creeping for quite some time and have rarely suffered losses...
Also, consume corpse is a nice skill. Just as you thought you ran out of the 300 or so mana (with thanks to familiars) to cast puppet master/frenzy...you get another 100+ mana from consume corpse. There had been times when I had afflicted the opponent's creatures with all my dark magic and still, I had mana leftover...
|
|
Bombur
Known Hero
|
|
posted July 27, 2007 06:46 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Somehow I've been using the cerebi tactics for creeping for quite some time and have rarely suffered losses...
Also, consume corpse is a nice skill. Just as you thought you ran out of the 300 or so mana (with thanks to familiars) to cast puppet master/frenzy...you get another 100+ mana from consume corpse. There had been times when I had afflicted the opponent's creatures with all my dark magic and still, I had mana leftover...
The cerberi are completely useless against 3 stacks of druids or mages or even master hunters.I suggest you that against archers you use gating.Against casters i use succubuses and pitlords.The casters usually go for my familiers or Nightmares.
____________
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted July 27, 2007 08:31 PM |
|
|
|
familiars are way too valuable to waste them that way..
|
|
Sanyu
Known Hero
|
|
posted July 29, 2007 08:28 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
Somehow I've been using the cerebi tactics for creeping for quite some time and have rarely suffered losses...
Also, consume corpse is a nice skill. Just as you thought you ran out of the 300 or so mana (with thanks to familiars) to cast puppet master/frenzy...you get another 100+ mana from consume corpse. There had been times when I had afflicted the opponent's creatures with all my dark magic and still, I had mana leftover...
The cerberi are completely useless against 3 stacks of druids or mages or even master hunters.I suggest you that against archers you use gating.Against casters i use succubuses and pitlords.The casters usually go for my familiers or Nightmares.
Familiars and nightmares are the last two creatures I want to lose!!!
|
|
Moonlith
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
|
|
posted July 29, 2007 02:25 PM |
|
|
I may have a little crazy suggestion for Inferno's creeping problem: High level creeping.
Go for five stacks of pitlords and rain down havoc upon neutrals, you'd be surprised how insanely fast it clears. You generally don't even need to use fireball, 5 meteor showers tend to do the trick. For me anyway 
Pre-requirement is succubi, which can help in creeping as well if you don't have 5 pitlords yet.
Probably a costy route, you'd have to focus all your materials in getting pit lords asap. But I find the effect to be quite relishing.
Anyone tried this?
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted July 29, 2007 02:41 PM |
|
|
By the time you do that the opponent will be halfway through creeping 
Pitlords are not worth the trouble as you cannot depend on them for a hero battle. You'd rather have build devils a week earlier than upgrading the fiends.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Moonlith
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
|
|
posted July 29, 2007 02:48 PM |
|
|
I'm too easily swayed for cool looks and cool mass-meteor shower effects 
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted July 29, 2007 02:54 PM |
|
|
Hey coolness has its price 
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
|
|
posted July 30, 2007 06:46 AM |
|
|
I often skip pit lords for devil, well, ofc it depends on the maps.
About cerberi tactic, i think it's not that good, their damage per week is not that good, i prefer to upg demon rather than having cerberi, because cerberi will drain much gold per week and their damage is not that good, worst, againts caster and shooter they are totally useless. Dunno why, i feel that demons is not that bad, upg-ing them is worth, and letting them die is a very bad choice.
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted July 30, 2007 08:22 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Hey coolness has its price
heh coolness often =/= power
reminds me of berserker axe breath of the dying in diablo 2, powerful but looks like a f***ing lollipop..
|
|
feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted July 31, 2007 02:43 PM |
|
|
|
I really dunno what is all the discussion for... Only competitive heroes for Inferno are Deleb and Grok. All the rest have bigger or lesser drawbacks. I really hope that all those crappy heroes will be remade in the expansion/patches/mods
|
|
demonking
Hired Hero
Who says demons ain't awesome?
|
posted October 23, 2009 12:19 PM |
|
|
Quote:
I often skip pit lords for devil,
ARE YOU INSANE
pit lords look and are awesome!
vorpal sword.....nough said
____________
first use your common sence, and if that doesn't work, USE YER IMAGINATION!
|
|
demonking
Hired Hero
Who says demons ain't awesome?
|
|
posted October 23, 2009 12:22 PM |
|
|
Quote:
I really dunno what is all the discussion for... Only competitive heroes for Inferno are Deleb and Grok. All the rest have bigger or lesser drawbacks. I really hope that all those crappy heroes will be remade in the expansion/patches/mods
guess what? they have and now there are awesome alt upgrades! and i agree that grok is awesome when used with inferno! easy teleporting from day one!
____________
first use your common sence, and if that doesn't work, USE YER IMAGINATION!
|
|
Eden
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted October 23, 2009 07:45 PM |
|
|
Interesting that the swap of The Demon Lord's knowledge and Power be mentioned, it makes since for the Destructive force they should have. I've always wished (and knew I'd never get) the Inferno faction split between Devils and Demons (Devils being more Defense and Knowledge aligned while Demons being more attack and power aligned).
As for Creeping I generally have no huge problems, Familiars and my Hero worked nicely together w/ gating in the early stages of the game. I've always said that if you gave me a Demon Lord with a Knight's skill progression, Inferno would rule all.
From my experience in creeping you need to be patient with Inferno, the early stages are not easy for you, but even against Ranged attackers if you plan your gating tricks and heroes' combats actions right you can punch through well enough.
I've found Inferno to be a lot of fun in the hit and run type of way, both early and late game. Sadly I find that late game other faction's power start to ace you, so inferno then needs to win with incremental advantages: Gating, Succubi hitting more then one thing, Pit Lords stomping defense and using mass damage on magic weak targets, Nightmare scaring ranged attackers into losing actions and the Devil playing the best kind of tier 7 beat down the faction can pull (Shame The Demon Lord can't normally bless the Devils, did it once I was killing everything!) and the Cerberi doing hitting multiple targets at once with no retaliation. Not to mention the Heroes' reactive and active abilities. To me every battle with Inferno is about the small advantages that each have a strategy, and in the end build up.
Sadly I've found the faction to lack blunt power, but I still find it the funniest to play in my friends big multiplayer games. We speak of Grok and Deleb being the only useful Heroes, I find that debatable (Though Deleb is stupid strong in my opinion she is largely unfun, for me at least): Both the Cerberi Hero and the Succubi Hero I've had good success with...I like Grok for his mobility, and Teleport assault is cool with demons early on but got boring for me.
____________
If I must die, I will encounter darkness as a bride, And hug it in mine arms." —William Shakespeare, Measure for Measure
|
|
scythesong
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted October 24, 2009 09:45 PM |
|
|
Quote:
I really dunno what is all the discussion for... Only competitive heroes for Inferno are Deleb and Grok. All the rest have bigger or lesser drawbacks. I really hope that all those crappy heroes will be remade in the expansion/patches/mod
You can't have all of them be perfect for duel-ish type maps. Would you choose Grok in a map where he won't be able to move around a lot? What do you think would happen to the rest of the game if they made all inferno heroes as good all-around as Deleb?
I'm sure the inferno heroes were designed with the inferno faction foremost in the designers' minds. Everything else was secondary/a side effect.
Edit:
Quote:
I've found Inferno to be a lot of fun in the hit and run type of way, both early and late game. Sadly I find that late game other faction's power start to ace you, so inferno then needs to win with incremental advantages: Gating, Succubi hitting more then one thing, Pit Lords stomping defense and using mass damage on magic weak targets, Nightmare scaring ranged attackers into losing actions and the Devil playing the best kind of tier 7 beat down the faction can pull (Shame The Demon Lord can't normally bless the Devils, did it once I was killing everything!) and the Cerberi doing hitting multiple targets at once with no retaliation. Not to mention the Heroes' reactive and active abilities. To me every battle with Inferno is about the small advantages that each have a strategy, and in the end build up.
Sadly I've found the faction to lack blunt power, but I still find it the funniest to play in my friends big multiplayer games. We speak of Grok and Deleb being the only useful Heroes, I find that debatable (Though Deleb is stupid strong in my opinion she is largely unfun, for me at least): Both the Cerberi Hero and the Succubi Hero I've had good success with...I like Grok for his mobility, and Teleport assault is cool with demons early on but got boring for me.
There are indeed many hints that the faction was never made for gigantic clash battles, despite the fact that when forced into one it can still perform well (reasonably well, anyway).
It should make sense, as Demon Lords are quite powerful in normal maps (fast movers, good attack, gating, imps suck low level hero mana away, temptresses are very deadly early on...). I agree with you that instead of pulling off all those "increments" in that one last battle, I think the demon lord was meant to split those "increments" in all the battles that will soon lead to that final one.
Ironically this play-style is similar to that of the old H3 Ramparts faction (iirc the antithesis to the old Inferno). It sucked in one-big-clash-battles, but it had fast heroes and units capable of running around you in circles while flagging your mines, picking off your wandering heroes and taking your lightly protected towns.
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted October 24, 2009 09:49 PM |
|
|
Oh please, warmachines are not everything. Undoubtedly helps early but it's not the best skill for a final battle and demonlords can learn machines rather easily anyway.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
El_Chita
Known Hero
Actually, my name is El Chita
|
|
posted October 24, 2009 10:33 PM |
|
|
But it's a good skill for Inferno, isn't it ?
I mean, Attack, Knowledge...
Demons are predestinated for Warmachines
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted October 25, 2009 02:58 AM |
|
|
Indeed but regular warmachines are only good in rushing and in longer games even if you take flaming arrows chances are that the ballista will only shoot once leaving you with many wasted skills. If it does shoot. Of course if the map has tough neutrals you don't have much of a choice.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
|
|
This thread is pages long: 
