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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted September 11, 2012 09:03 PM |
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Edited by Corribus at 21:20, 11 Sep 2012.
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The simple point of fact is that atheists do act morally, therefore the contention that atheists have no reason to act morally is obviously false.
A better question to ask is why anyone acts morally, but why would you actually want to have a real philosophical discussion when we can just paint an entire group of people with broad brush strokes, and conclude that since they all obviously believe this or that, then none of them have a reason to be good, moral people? 
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted September 11, 2012 09:22 PM |
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Quote:
why anyone acts morally
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Adrius
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
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posted September 11, 2012 09:24 PM |
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Link works fine for me.
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted September 11, 2012 09:35 PM |
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The fault was of short duration, is currently operating. Aha Corribus wrote. Ok maybe later make. 
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted September 11, 2012 09:48 PM |
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Because the mere fact that you would feel sad about the dire situation of your mates,parents,girlfriend,children etc, creates incentive to help them. In essence, morality allows groups to survive, instead of eating each other out.
I don't think this is the best defintion. It begs for "me and my family vs. everyone else". It takes a deeper understanding to consider all human beings equal, something you can't just trivialize to biological connections to those close to you. It's more of a philosophical matter.
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted September 11, 2012 09:48 PM |
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The very idea that one can act morally only if he/she has some reward to strive for (afterlife bliss, etc.) is 100% materialistic.  That's not really relevant anyway but tying the moral strictly to the religion doesn't really show a good understanding of either of them.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted September 11, 2012 09:58 PM |
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Morals are deeper than doing just what benefits oneself and one's immediate circle of friends and family. Humans have the ability to empathize with complete strangers. Putting religion aside, there's a definite advantage to any social organism that has this kind of trait.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 11, 2012 10:06 PM |
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I don't think this is the best defintion. It begs for "me and my family vs. everyone else".
my religion vs everyone else.
hey, I read that about Islam one day : the guy was claiming that Islam is the best religion because when everyone will be a muslim, there will be peace on earth. 
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted September 11, 2012 10:18 PM |
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..Islam is the best religion because when everyone will be a muslim, there will be peace on earth
Now that is true faith
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 11, 2012 10:29 PM |
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if there is an absolute moral code, that means a machine could be moral?
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted September 11, 2012 10:46 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 22:54, 11 Sep 2012.
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Quote:
hey, I read that about Islam one day : the guy was claiming that Islam is the best religion because when everyone will be a muslim, there will be peace on earth.
Hahaha, these people are not even aware that they are also contributors to violence, even more so than others.
A global theocratic dictature would surely impose its will over the people. No wonder this guy thinks there will be "Peace". One just has to look at any islamic country to see what I mean. Very un-peaceful.
He probably mislabeled peace with tyranny though. If we were to go a bit further, we could conclude that the rleigion of Islam has problems with the words: freedom and peace.
In fact, dogma and freedom can not coexist.
The grounds for judgement whether something is morally right and wrong are the levels of benefit and unnecessary pain the actions of someone or ours cause.
Coupled with the varying empathy we have for each other, we have the grounds of proof that we have an evolving moral code. Slavery is immoral today, women are equal to men etc, this goes at least in developed countries.
This is far superior to grounding a code in orders from an unobservable magical being through a contradictory/incomplete code in a "holy" book.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted September 12, 2012 12:30 AM |
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Which is completely false, as in Islamic countries they still kill each other for one reason or another. I don't know why Seraphim was shocked when I definite Islam as cancer, it has same behavior, it spreads chaotically and nothing can stop it.
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Era II mods and utilities
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gnomes2169
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Duke of the Glade
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posted September 12, 2012 01:19 AM |
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Which is completely false, as in Islamic countries they still kill each other for one reason or another. I don't know why Seraphim was shocked when I definite Islam as cancer, it has same behavior, it spreads chaotically and nothing can stop it.
Ooooor it could be that Islam is this thing called a "Personal faith" and you sort of can't control what a person believes or chooses to believe, so it spreads chaotically based on who chooses to believe it.
In every country, people still kill or commit crimes regardless of the faith of the country itself, the justification just differs from "My faith gives me this right" to "My need (Which is greater than yours) gives me this right" or any combination thereof. Doesn't really matter where you go, people will still be doing stupid things and people will also be doing good things, regardless of justification it is the same. Pinning the blame on a faith just doesn't work when the problem isn't with a specific faith or any ideology at all, since even something as simple as "Do good for your fellow man" can be twisted to suit whatever desires you have.
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Yeah in the 18th century, two inventions suggested a method of measurement. One won and the other stayed in America.
-Ghost destroying Fred
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted September 12, 2012 02:14 AM |
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The fact that an atheist claims that stoning in any way is immoral is retarded, why would you care about morality? You don't see a lion lying in remorse for killing all those antelopes, or for eating the young of the lioness that weren't his.
Indeed, there are no rational grounds in a materialistic atheistic world view for calling anything moral, immoral, right, wrong, good, or evil. In a materialistic world view "moral" is only one person's opinion. On person thinks it is ok to rape babies so for him it is. Another thinks it is wrong to rape babies so for him it is wrong. But from a materialistic atheistic world view neither position can be defended as an absolute moral. To admit that even a single thing is absolutely immoral is to admit that a deity exists. Atheism is tied to fairy tale that no God exists so a person who wants to be consistent in his arguments who holds that dogma can't rationally argue that anything is immoral.
There are in fact atheists on this board who do argue that absolute morality, good, and evil do no exist. I applaud them for their consistency though their faith in oblivion is lamentable.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted September 12, 2012 04:47 AM |
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Edited by artu at 21:23, 12 Sep 2012.
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Well, by "absolute" if you mean a universal code that stands above all historical, cultural, anthropological progress no matter what, you are right, there is no moral code like that. But atheists also have a conscience and like anyone else they are aware that a person's actions have consequences and as a specie with high intelligence we may better the world we live in by behaving a little different than the lion. (btw, when it comes to food, religious or non-religious we all act like the lion.)
Defining a moral code as something the human mind constructed does not categorically qualify it as useless or empty as the religious people are so eager to think so. Our moral behavior evolved with our intelligence.Watch the linked video, you might find it very interesting:
http://www.ted.com/talks/robert_sapolsky_the_uniqueness_of_humans.html
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted September 12, 2012 06:47 AM |
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As with all promises of faith, it simply boils down to one immovable truth. Religions promise you exactly what you want to be promised. With Christianity, they go down the pious but altogether peaceful concept of a cloudy paradise, where all of your loved ones that have passed on will meet you. This promise essentially nullifies the grandest fear of the believer, death. With Islam, it's a bit more obvious, where it isn't just a cloudy paradise, but you also get a fu*kton of virgins to do with as you please. This promise reinforces Islam's position as a religion entirely built upon chauvinism-what could I promise a man in the afterlife to guarantee he will believe. I know, how about the one thing guys constantly crave, clean pussy-.
Afterlives all vary in their descriptions, but the one thing they have in common is, coincidentally, they all feature a beautiful idea. Almost too beautiful some might say.
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Era II mods and utilities
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GunFred
Supreme Hero
Sexy Manticore
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posted September 12, 2012 01:13 PM |
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Which is completely false, as in Islamic countries they still kill each other for one reason or another. I don't know why Seraphim was shocked when I definite Islam as cancer, it has same behavior, it spreads chaotically and nothing can stop it.
Which is why we must take care of and help these sick people so that they one day may be cured.
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted September 12, 2012 01:33 PM |
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Since the policy needs a moral decision-making. U.S. know how to make the war. Therefore, how to teach morals. Students begin to talk, etc. Since not believe in it, so not good politician than in America. Where is education? Ok People are not able to make copies of believers. When they have a high value. So people are making the state the law, etc. Yes the U.S. is going to hell. For example, in the hospital .. You know, blood transfusion, or insulin. Why are Muslims? Just peace in the country is fully true. Human problem, as not complying with the Bible.
The old school of philosophy founded by then teach the state for men. Because they do not read the Bible.
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted September 12, 2012 04:03 PM |
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help these sick people so that they one day may be cured.
I'm certain that the same thing is coursing through their minds. 
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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GunFred
Supreme Hero
Sexy Manticore
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posted September 12, 2012 04:11 PM |
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help these sick people so that they one day may be cured.
I'm certain that the same thing is coursing through their minds.
Hahahaha! Touché!
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