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fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 19, 2012 01:08 AM |
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actually that would create the same distinction between machines and us as between slaves and citizens a long time ago.
quite the contrary of what we have now btw.
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted April 19, 2012 01:14 AM |
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Are hammers, solar cells and cars slaves too in the same way then? What is the difference?
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 19, 2012 01:17 AM |
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what if we start cloning people and make them our slaves instead?
would the neaderthals be our slaves if they were alive?
I'm so sad they died... its the closest thing we had to a real fantasy world with lots of different races...
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted April 19, 2012 01:18 AM |
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Why would you even want slaves in the first place?
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fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 19, 2012 02:26 AM |
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well the hammer requires you to manipulate it. there isn't much point in having slaves if you must guide their hands all the time. better do the job yourself...
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Darkshadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted April 19, 2012 06:16 AM |
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Quote:
I've been thinking a lot what is going to happen if robots would take all jobs.
What would everybody else do?
Sit at home, eat kebab and play World of Warcraft XII-2? (it's the new Final Fantasy!)
We would all get so bored that eventually there would a giant orgy and after that, bodies in the streets, cities burning etc etc.
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Adrius
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
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posted April 19, 2012 08:54 AM |
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Don't we have these oil countries where the only workers are immigrants and the local population just chill and party all day long?
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted April 19, 2012 08:57 AM |
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted April 19, 2012 10:38 AM |
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Quote:
well the hammer requires you to manipulate it. there isn't much point in having slaves if you must guide their hands all the time. better do the job yourself...
So any self sustaining system which provides benefits for other systems otherwise independent is equivalent to slavery?
It's slavery when my alarm clocks rings every morning at the same time inedepent of me, for my benefit? It's slavery when I run programs to make my day easier, because the programs runs without me, but provides me benefit? Is the ford automatic assembly line slavery?
Slavery is when someone else decides over your life, I'd guess. The point here is that machines doing these tasks aren't alive. Merely a self sustaining system which provides a benefit for us. Because you make something automatic, does not mean it becomes slavery. For slavery, we'd have to create life in the machines and then force them to do our bidding. Both creating life as well as having an automatic system which can make our life better seems like reasonable goals, but it does not mean a combination of those two things is a reasonable assumption.
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fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 19, 2012 12:14 PM |
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Edited by fauch at 12:15, 19 Apr 2012.
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well no, I wanted to say, we would use machines the same way we used slaves, so that we can do something else while they provide us with all we need to live.
but machines aren't slaves.
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted April 19, 2012 12:28 PM |
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Oh, sorry about misunderstanding you then.
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted April 19, 2012 05:41 PM |
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Doomforge:
Quote:
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yeah but over a 100 000 uneducated and many times analphabetic immigrants can't get a job just like that
Without welfare, they would starve. Knowing that, they probably wouldn't bother coming to your country in the first place, no?
I for one, agree. The problem is to get the world economy back to a high conjucture/speed phase, and then welfare can be dumped.But this also carries a bunch of problems, but its far less serious if the national economy is in good shape. If everyone can get a job by just asking around(a tiny bit), then frankly, there is no major need of welfare.
It would also serve as a major hub for intigration, providing that nobody sets up a ghetto, that is. It would also not solve the current ghetto problems, sadly.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted April 21, 2012 01:55 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 15:09, 21 Apr 2012.
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Its similar to a child being molested analogy.
If a parent,or other people, molest a kid during childhood,that child will most probably molest his children or other people when he gets older.
I hope I dont offend somebody.
Also,it is quite a trend to be against arabs and muslims since september 2001.
It is not like there is a alot of thought going on when there is hate speech. People in euorpe placate the problem of some criminal immigrants to whole nations and the rest is common sense.
Edit:
having read the thread I am asking you people, do you really think that your wellfare causes immigration? Well,you obviously do.
The reason immigration is happening to your "Defunct" societies is because your "State" offers a future to them.
Do you really think that people make 2000 km in order to work as a toilet cleaner and in the end get bashed by some bigoted racist?
There is not much choice.Either die or find a way to survive or do big profit.
Needless to say,some dont work and conduct in criminality.
Maybe you should take your ignorant glasses out and see it as a problem of poverty and criminality in your country.
There are already rules that disallow immigration and are racist. Also,what most people dont understand is that immigrants dont really "CHOOSE" what country they immigrate to.
Did you know that it takes 10 years or was it 12 to work in poland in order to get the Polish citizenship?Add the minimum they should earn and more and more....
This is the case with allot of countries.
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Erm last I checked all classes pay taxes.
If turning humans into parasites is your idea of equality, then I feel sorry for you.
We humans are parasites by nature.Why do you think we use cows and chickens and technology?
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I don't know about commies, but when you have 10 millions muslims in your country-and quickly growing-, I would be scared if no one thinks they are potential huge threat. Poland does not have them, I see no reason to worry, they are all in France or UK right now. And we feel it every day, painful.
Karma is a snow. Those colonialists are making life hell in france it seems. What you are experiencing is when a part of your population is extremely impoverished and or uneducated.
Maybe you should kick those that are criminal but I dont think thats your problem really.
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Merah: his father was allowed to sue french state because his son was killed by police. While the best move would have been to send his entire family asap in Alger, for extreme failing on integration and education of own kids. Crazy world.
No comment....
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And to answer your first tirade about France being racist, it is common sense that one will immigrate in the best country for him, not in the worse.
This implies choice.Do you really think all baddies choose your country? You must be victimizing your self too much.
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The one where he will get help and assistance, which is quite opposite to racism. So, following your tirade, the 500 000 immigrants entering each year in France choose by masochism the most racist country? Think a bit before writing enormities.
How many of those stay?
Also,you do realize that you are accepting people from countries which are at war or whatnot. Why dont you give them some probation time?
"Needless to say,why care about immigrants anyways.if they die,its their problem.We want our land preserved." General European attitude.
And then you are complaining why they dont wanna assimilate...
However,they dont assimilate because they have been grown up in a different society and that the country they have immigrated hates them...
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted April 21, 2012 02:44 PM |
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I am not sure if I agree that following political correctness is the right thing to do™. For one, this minority of immigrants is usually performing such a scale of crime that it outpaces its representation compared to per population. Its a bit like the jews, a tiny % of the population that is severly overrepresented in the upper classes of society, only as a negative trend.
And even worse, the problem won't be solved until there is more action to actually solve it. And what is this problem? Its a combination of the black marked having access to a good potential source of revenue, a somewhat wrongly prioritized police, we letting in a small bunch of who refuse to ingtigrate, the existance of ghettos bring allowed to exist, and a political correctness that labels somebody who just want to do a few minor alterations to fix this mess as a nazi.
Perhaps it is people who read tabloids, is also a severe problem, if the problem really is that people can get a bad view of a good majority contra the minority, then should not the problem be to fix it at its core: Do something about the immigrants minority of criminals, and do something about the tabloids giving the sheeps a wrong idea of reality?
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted April 21, 2012 03:10 PM |
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Those who're a problem is not in an easy defined group of people. The only correct labelling of criminals are criminals. But it's so much easier to group criminals with another well defined group, because then you can actually distinct. But it's living in a "dream" world where every problem have an obvious and easy solution. Every single person should be "judged" for who they are, and not for for whatever label they're part of. E.g. judging people due to ancestry or whatever else defining factor is applied (like dark hair).
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted April 21, 2012 03:32 PM |
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Quote:
However,they dont assimilate because they have been grown up in a different society and that the country they have immigrated hates them...
I would phrase it in a different way:
-However,they dont assimilate because they have been grown up in a different society. You are right.
-Their society is mostly based on violence, hate and ignorance. Why, I don't know.
-Thus, it is highly incompatible with our society.
-Could their society evolve and reach higher standards, thus allow mixing? Unlikely, both a quick and long view at their countries actual status shows inertia and constant internal wars.
-The country they have immigrated in hates them because they are trouble makers and greatly increase the insecurity feeling, while constantly posing as victims. Note that those being "assimilated" do not represent any potential threat. But their percentage is low, unfortunately.
____________
Era II mods and utilities
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted April 21, 2012 03:48 PM |
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Quote:
I would phrase it in a different way:
-However,they dont assimilate because they have been grown up in a different society. You are right.
Quote:
-Their society is mostly based on violence, hate and ignorance. Why, I don't know.
No society is based on violence.
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-Could their society evolve and reach higher standards, thus allow mixing? Unlikely, both a quick and long view at their countries actual status shows inertia and constant internal wars.
Unlikely is not impossible.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted April 21, 2012 03:50 PM |
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Quote:
No society is based on violence.
I think that totalitarian societies are based on violence.
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Era II mods and utilities
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted April 21, 2012 04:18 PM |
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Their society is based in violence, hate and ignorance as much as the French society is based on depravity, megalomania and Anglophobia. Generalizations rule.
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fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 21, 2012 06:13 PM |
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Quote:
-Their society is mostly based on violence, hate and ignorance. Why, I don't know.
probably ours too.
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