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antipaladin
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of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted June 05, 2010 05:22 PM |
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i wanted to qoute the 6't violent ship discussion with the navy captin who requested to change course before the take over:
Navy officer: "this is the israel navy force,please change your course"
ship captin: " Go back to Aushwits"
case closed.if i heard that statement i'd fire the bullet myself.
Quote:
He has never said he wants to destroy or annihilate the nation of Israel. He has made it quite clear he wants the regime dead, which is hardly unique to him.
are you kidding he had said that meny times!
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types in obscure english
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Cepheus
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posted June 05, 2010 05:38 PM |
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Quote:
How convenient, that Irish humanitarian ship. 
You said it not me.
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VokialBG
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posted June 05, 2010 05:44 PM |
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Quote:
Navy officer: "this is the israel navy force,please change your course"
ship captin: " Go back to Aushwits"
case closed.if i heard that statement i'd fire the bullet myself.
You have the right to go with retorsia, or whatever is called in English - means when someone offend you like that you can offend him back, but this way you can't use the court. Using the weapon makes you a criminal.
I'm just saying, it's not for the concrete case. But in the meaning of the concrete case - they don't have the right to do nothing more than offend them back with words or actions.
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Homam
Known Hero
Sailor of the open seas
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posted June 05, 2010 06:02 PM |
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I've heard that Turkey plans to send a vessel with humanitarian aid with a warship for protection and on the the vessel will be as a passenger the turkish prime minister.If that happens i wanna see how big are Israel's guts.What are they gonna do?Turkey is not Syria neither Egypt.Turkey is a great power and the only one currently able in the area to stop Israel's arrogance.Not to mention Iran.
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antipaladin
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posted June 05, 2010 06:05 PM |
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sink them? 
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Cepheus
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posted June 05, 2010 06:34 PM |
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Quote:
retorsia, or whatever is called in English - means when someone offend you like that you can offend him back
Probably "retort" is the word you're looking for.
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baklava
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posted June 05, 2010 06:35 PM |
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Edited by baklava at 18:36, 05 Jun 2010.
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@HoMaM
Is that true?
I'm gonna go get some popcorn just in case.
What a strange feeling, wars and crap actually happening somewhere else.
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Geny
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted June 05, 2010 06:53 PM |
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@HoMaM
If that is true there's a good chance that Turkey will be the one breaking international laws and then there will be absolutely no doubt that Israel can blow the warship to smithereens in self-defense. Again, I do not know the actual law, so I might be wrong, but bringing armed vessels through Israel's waters (which I believe they will have to do in order to get to Gaza) sounds quite criminal to me.
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ohforfsake
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posted June 05, 2010 07:23 PM |
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Quote:
i wanted to qoute the 6't violent ship discussion with the navy captin who requested to change course before the take over:
Navy officer: "this is the israel navy force,please change your course"
ship captin: " Go back to Aushwits"
case closed.if i heard that statement i'd fire the bullet myself.
If it wasn't because I'm convinced you're joking, or playing to your emotions, and that it's not a valid fundament to sufficiently judge someone through statements given at random, then a statement like that would make me rather worried seeing as you're in the military yourself.
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Darkshadow
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posted June 05, 2010 09:22 PM |
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Quote:
I've heard that Turkey plans to send a vessel with humanitarian aid with a warship for protection and on the the vessel will be as a passenger the turkish prime minister.If that happens i wanna see how big are Israel's guts.What are they gonna do?Turkey is not Syria neither Egypt.Turkey is a great power and the only one currently able in the area to stop Israel's arrogance.Not to mention Iran.
This is a thing that breaks international laws, and in that case Israel has all the rights to sink both ships.
Fun facts: turkey will also be held in leash by US, and turkey is not a great power by international standards.
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blizzardboy
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posted June 06, 2010 12:44 AM |
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The Turkish prime minister is not getting on board a ship and going blockade running... I assume... and hope.
I'm not sure what exactly they're doing, but they might just be going along with ships for inspections. Or they're actually being gung ho and escorting a blockade runner. Turkey is not a push over though. They've got American weaponry and a pretty well trained and large force. They're not like Syria whose idea of target practice is shooting rats in a ditch.
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Homam
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posted June 06, 2010 01:30 AM |
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Taken from Guardian
"All of which leaves an isolated Israel in a deep dilemma, made all the more difficult because many Israelis do not understand the reason for the outrage. "It's good that they filmed it at least," says one Israeli woman at Jerusalem's Hebrew university gym last week, commenting on the footage of the assault playing on the screens overhead – a video clip released by the Israeli army which shows the activists attacking the Israeli troops with clubs and iron bars as they arrive on deck, claimed as evidence of a premeditated, violent attack.
Her friend, also watching, says: "But you know, I heard that overseas they still don't believe us." The first woman lets out an exasperated gasp. "How is that possible?" she asks.
That, in microcosm, is the result of the assault on the flotilla – a widening chasm between Israel's view of its actions and the way they are seen around the world. Because the army is conscripted, Israeli society and its military are intimately bound and, as a consequence, the army is trusted to tell the truth. What raises more eyebrows is the accompanying inability to see why the Israeli perspective on events might not echo globally."
It reminded me of some voices here.
Read the full article here
Article
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OmegaDestroyer
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Fox or Chicken?
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posted June 06, 2010 02:24 AM |
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baklava
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posted June 06, 2010 03:31 AM |
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Edited by baklava at 03:44, 06 Jun 2010.
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Oh you've got to be ****ting me.
I'd love to say that I don't know whether I'd rather laugh or cry, but I'll most likely just end up sighing deeply and slowly shaking my head again.
God help you all.
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is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Geny
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted June 06, 2010 04:46 PM |
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@HoMaM
I'm having difficulties understanding what was the point of your last post. I may have an idea, but to avoid misunderstandings could you explain it to me again before I respond?
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ohforfsake
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posted June 06, 2010 05:50 PM |
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Please correct me, as I probably have not understood the situation correct.
Israel are directly threatened by another country, or area, from which there's a high risk of rockets getting fired into Israel. The country of which this area is a part of is unable to do something about if, either because they can't or don't want to.
As I see it, clearly as long as the given country claims the area to be theirs, it's an act of war. The only reasonable thing as I see it, from this countries view point, is for troops from Israel getting to move freely in the area or even get to rent the area (which produces job for isrealic people and probably needed money for the given country, also it means that the soldiers can much more easily secure the area). [Keep on doing this, until the country in question is of a size it can control].
However, if I understood correct, what Israel does, in stead of attacking their enemy, by changing the areas environment so they can't shoot missiles at them anymore (no attacking an enemy does not need to mean catch them, or do anything towards them, just so that they can't perform the actions of which defines them as an enemy), they in stead have decided to hinder all transport to this area (country?), which to me makes no sense. It's like if all countries around Germany would prevent planes, ships and land transport to reach Germany.
Now please explain it to me.
*Goes for popcorn*
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Shares
Supreme Hero
I am. Thusly I am.
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posted June 06, 2010 06:08 PM |
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Edited by Shares at 18:08, 06 Jun 2010.
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The thing is that Israel never officially declared war (they did, and won so the official war is over). So instead they built a big wall around the land and a blockade at the sea. These things are usually illegal, unless there's a war going on. So somehow it's a semiwar or something. Or have I to misunderstood something?
Popcorn would be nice! Can I have some? Thanks! *Crunch* Mmm! Salty!
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Elodin
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posted June 06, 2010 07:58 PM |
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Edited by Elodin at 20:01, 06 Jun 2010.
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Some Gaza background for those unfamiliar with it. I have combined information from several sources and thrown in a few comments of my own.
7th century CE: The Gaza territory comes under Muslim rule.
http://www.slate.com/id/2182754
The Gaza Strip is a roughly rectangular territory surrounding the city of Gaza, wedged between the Mediterranean Sea and Israel. To the southwest, it shares a seven-mile border with Egypt. The region has a long history of occupation—by the ancient Egyptians, the Philistines, the Arabs, the Christian Crusaders, and the Ottomans. After World War I, the Gaza area became part of the British Mandate of Palestine, and it was occupied by Egypt in 1948, in the aftermath of the first Arab-Israeli war.
The rectangular Gaza Strip is about 25 miles long and three to seven miles wide. One long side lies along the Mediterranean. One short, straight end borders Egypt: This follows the border that existed between Egypt and the British Mandate of Palestine. The other sides of the rectangle—a long, ragged edge and a shorter, northeastern side—separate the Gaza Strip from Israel. This border was established after the first Arab-Israeli War, which also resulted in the creation of Israel. The Gaza region became Egypt's military headquarters during the 1948 conflict, and the narrow coastal strip saw heavy fighting. When the cease-fire was announced later that year—following a decisive Israeli victory—the final position of the military fronts became what's known as "the Green Line," or the border between the Palestinian territories (both the Gaza Strip and the West Bank) and Israel.
http://judaism.about.com/od/politics/a/gaza_history.htm
1948-49
British troops leave Mandatory Palestine. The State of Israel is declared.
In the Israeli war of Independence, thousands of Palestinians, fleeing other cities like Jaffa and Beersheba, settle in the Gaza Strip, mostly in refugee camps. Gaza Strip's population triples.
May: Egyptian forces move up along the Palestinian coastline in an attempt to reach Tel Aviv. Being pushed back by Jewish forces, a British ceasefire agreement stops the Jewish troops while the Egyptians still hold the Gaza territory. Soon after, large groups of Palestinian refugees arrive in Gaza.
— During the Egyptian occupation little is done to improve the conditions in the Gaza Strip and the borders between Egypt and the occupied Strip are virtually closed. The Gazan population receives no citizenship, and large portions of the population survive on UN relief efforts.
1956:
As part of the Suez-Sinai War, the Gaza Strip is occupied by Israel, but Israel leaves as a result of international pressure.
1967
Arab nations surrounded Israel to destroy the nation. Israel kicked their collective butts during what is called the Six Day War. In the process Israel captured the Gaza Strip . The Arabs cried to the UN and the UN demanded that Israel give the land back to the Egypt, which had had tried to destroy Israel. Israel tells the UN to take a flying leap.
1970-72
In 1970, Kfar Darom - a Jewish community in the Strip evacuated in 1948 - is re-established as a para-military Nahal outpost. In 1972, Netzer Hazani, the first civilian Jewish community in the Gaza Strip, is founded. And Netzarim and Morag are founded as para-military Nahal outposts.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nahal
1978
Israel and Egypt sign the Camp David Accords, in which they pledge to try to reach an agreement on Palestinian autonomy in the Gaza Strip and West Bank. In response, Jewish settlement groups start to establish more settlements to ensure Jewish presence in the Gaza Strip. Jewish settlement in the Gaza Strip grows in the 1980s.
1994
The Gaza-Jericho Agreement is signed; IDF forces leave most of the Strip's Palestinian inhabited areas, but maintain control of the Jewish settlements, borders and certain strategic points.
Israel withdrew from parts of the Gaza Strip as part of its obligations under the Oslo Accords (which also affirmed the rights of the Palestinians to self-government). The Palestinian National Authority and Israel shared power in the Gaza Strip for the next 10 years, with the PNA administering civilian control and the Israelis overseeing military affairs as well as the borders, airspace, and remaining Israeli settlements.
1995
Hamas and Islamic Jihad carry out suicide bombings against Israelis. Israel surrounds the Strip with a security fence. Israel and the Palestinian Authority sign the Israeli-Palestinian Interim Agreement on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip.
2000-01
Camp David Summit fails. The Second Intifada begins. Jewish settlements in Gaza suffer constant attacks. Palestinians in Gaza fire missiles at Israeli communities in the Negev. Israeli helicopters attack targets in Palestinian areas, and IDF tanks enter refugee camps. Curfews placed on Palestinians, security at checkpoints increased.
2003-04
In response to Palestinian attacks, the IDF recaptures parts of the Gaza Strip. Prime Minister Ariel Sharon presents a Disengagement Plan from Gaza and the northern West Bank.
2005
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon unilaterally ended military rule in the region and withdrew all Israeli settlements, thus bringing all areas of the Gaza Strip under Palestinian administration.*
2007
Hamas seized control of the Gaza Strip, causing a division between the region and the other Palestinian territory, the West Bank, where the Fatah party is dominant.
June: Heavy fighting between Hamas and Fatah militia. Hamas, being the strongest party of the two on the Gaza Strip, manages to secure control over most important positions.
2008 December 20:
Hamas declares it will not prolong the cease-fire signed in June. Hamas blames Israel for having closed borders for little but humanitarian aid, and begins shooting off rockets into Israeli territory.
— December 26: Israel opens several border points to Gaza, but Hamas' attacks on Israel continues.
— December 27: Israel launches a wave of air strikes on Gaza Strip, killing hundreds within few hours. Many civilians are killed, due to Hamas strategy of placing military installations among civilian homes. Within two weeks more than 800 Palestinian are killed, but the number of civilian is unusually low for any war, and especially for a war fought against military placed around civilian homes.
And so HAMAS continues to fire rockets into Israel, repeatedly breaking ceasefires.
http://www.slate.com/id/2182754
Who lives on the Gaza Strip?
Since the withdrawal of Israeli settlements, the Gazan population is almost entirely Palestinian Arab. More than 99 percent are Sunni Muslims, with a very small number of Christians. The region saw a huge influx of Palestinian refugees after the creation of Israel in 1948—within 20 years, the population of Gaza had grown to six times its previous size. The Gaza Strip now has one of the highest population densities in the world: Almost 1.5 million people live within its 146 square miles. Eighty percent of Gazans live below the poverty line.
Who built the fence between Gaza and Egypt? Who controls the border?
In 1979, Israel and Egypt signed a peace treaty that returned the Sinai Peninsula, which borders the Gaza Strip, to Egyptian control. As part of that treaty, a 100-meter-wide strip of land known as the Philadelphi corridor was established as a buffer zone between Gaza and Egypt. Israel built a barrier there during the Palestinian uprisings of the early 2000s. It's made mostly of corrugated sheet metal, with stretches of concrete topped with barbed wire.
In 2005, when Israel pulled out of the Gaza Strip, Israel and Egypt reached a military agreement regarding the border, based on the principles of the 1979 peace treaty. The agreement specified that 750 Egyptian border guards would be deployed along the length of the border, and both Egypt and Israel pledged to work together to stem terrorism, arms smuggling, and other illegal cross-border activities.
From November 2005 until July 2007, the Rafah Crossing—the only entry-exit point along the Gaza-Egypt border—was jointly controlled by Egypt and the Palestinian Authority, with the European Union monitoring Palestinian compliance on the Gaza side. After the Hamas takeover in June 2007, the European Union pulled out of the region, and Egypt agreed with Israel to shut down the Rafah Crossing, effectively sealing off the Gaza Strip on all sides.
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JoonasTo
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posted June 07, 2010 07:44 AM |
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And you forgot to mention the 50 years of terrorism the jews did prior to establishing israel...
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Shyranis
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posted June 07, 2010 12:07 PM |
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Quote:
1978
Israel and Egypt sign the Camp David Accords, in which they pledge to try to reach an agreement on Palestinian autonomy in the Gaza Strip and West Bank. In response, Jewish settlement groups start to establish more settlements to ensure Jewish presence in the Gaza Strip. Jewish settlement in the Gaza Strip grows in the 1980s.
Forgot to mention some extremists that would later be tied to Al-Qaeda killed President Sadat for making peace and signing a lasting (still in effect today) treaty with Israel.
Sadat is the same President that was also dismayed by the Iranian revolution and said to call it an Islamic revolution is an affront to Islam.
I'd be inclined to agree.
Radicals on both sides tend to exacerbate the problem and only seem to be in it to try to screw each other even if it hurts them more in the end.
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