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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted August 24, 2012 02:31 PM |
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Here you get life for one murder, and consecutive life sentences from there on out.
While the death penalty would bring a certain 'justice', I still believe that exile is the harshest penalty that can ever be applied to a person, (especially to Breivik) that he is not fit to ever walk upon the same ground as his own country-men for whom he shed the blood of countless kids and killed 77 of them. Prison? Torture? He'd gladly, go through it, I daresay he even prepared himself for the consequences, but exile? Hell I'd say a man who believes that he's doing his country a deluded favor, being exiled is the greatest punishment.
Sent to an offshore prison, his government paying for his food and stay (as they'd do normally) then once released, he's just another illegal immigrant and vagrant, tossed from one border to the next.
He killed 77 people for his country, take away what he's fighting for and put it beyond his reach, and voila, the most brutal punishment, that is if you're in the business of hurting people.
Personally? My opinion? What you have here is a patriot of the highest standard, deluded aye and a psychopath. This man killed 77 people for what he believes in, for his country, now instead of throwing such an asset to rot or to be killed, why not use it? This man's insane dedication might bring some good to this world yet, I believe that he was just misguided, which often happens to self-educated individuals.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted August 24, 2012 02:35 PM |
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Exile? What country would let someone like him into its borders, even after serving prison time? He's a major liability and will continue to be so until death. He needs to be put down like the mad dog he is.
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The giant has awakened
You drink my blood and drown
Wrath and raving I will not stop
You'll never take me down
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted August 24, 2012 02:38 PM |
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I was discussing how you'd hurt the man most and what methods would be useless, not the practicality. Which you are more than free to contest by the way.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 24, 2012 03:33 PM |
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the point isn't to hurt him, but to prevent him from hurting other people.
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted August 24, 2012 04:21 PM |
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Some may disagree.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 24, 2012 04:54 PM |
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I know. they think that their suffering can be eased only if what they think is the cause of that suffering suffers even more than them.
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Smithey
Promising
Supreme Hero
Yes im red, choke on it !!!
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posted August 24, 2012 06:38 PM |
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Edited by Smithey at 18:40, 24 Aug 2012.
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Quote:
I know. they think that their suffering can be eased only if what they think is the cause of that suffering suffers even more than them.
Thats oversimplifying & generalizing, I just dont think he deserves to breathe hence would rid the world of "the waste", what gives me the right to make that decision ? nothing thats just how I see things, not claiming you must agree with me or not....
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 24, 2012 06:48 PM |
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I never got the "MAKE THE THEM SUFFER!" people. What Breivik did was horrible, but does it make me happier if they torture him? NO.
That's not how we do things in a democracy. I would not want to live in such a cold society.
I think it was a good sentence though I'd like a ystem where a criminal can receive the death penalty if he or she wants too. If Breivik wanted to die, then that would be a win-win situation.
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted August 24, 2012 06:57 PM |
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Edited by Elodin at 18:59, 24 Aug 2012.
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Breivik apologizes to 'militant nationals' for not killing more. Breivik's smiles, smirks, salutes, and speeches show what he thinks of Norwegian justice.
Clcky
Quote:
Norwegian gunman Anders Behring Breivik apologized in court to "militant nationalists" for not having killed more than the 77 people he shot to death in a horrific spree last year.
....
Wearing a dark suit and sporting a thin beard, Breivik smirked as he walked into the courtroom to hear his sentence, and raised a clenched-fist salute.
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Revelation
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Brukernavn
Hero of Order
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posted August 24, 2012 07:14 PM |
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Before this discussion is derailed; Breivik will spend the rest of his life in jail. The maximum sentence in Norway is 21 years, but with detainment his sentence can be prolonged for 5 years at a time as long as he is seen as a danger to society. The verdict today argued very strongly that he is a high threat, so he'll most likely never get out.
Regarding the apology, he was interrupted by the judge after he said he wanted to apologize to other 'national militants'. What he actually apologized for is therefore heresay, although it's not unlikely he would say something like that.
As to the verdict itself, it was very well argued and solid. It described the crimes clearly, and argued well why he was to be punished, and not treated for insanity. The judges did an excellent job!
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted August 24, 2012 07:40 PM |
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Quote:
Regarding the apology, he was interrupted by the judge after he said he wanted to apologize to other 'national militants'. What he actually apologized for is therefore heresay, although it's not unlikely he would say something like that.
Here are his words.
Clicky
Quote:
"Since I don't recognize the authority of the court I cannot legitimize the Oslo district court by accepting the verdict," Breivik said. "At the same time I cannot appeal the verdict, because by appealing it I would legitimize the court."
Then, Breivik said he wanted to issue an apology, but it wasn't for the victims, most of the teenagers gunned down in one of the worst peacetime shooting massacres in modern history.
"I wish to apologize to all militant nationalists that I wasn't able to execute more," Breivik said.
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Revelation
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NoobX
Undefeatable Hero
Now, this is a paradox...
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posted August 24, 2012 07:41 PM |
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Because of this kind of people, Earth is a rotten place to live in.
"Kill", "destroy", "burn" are the thoughts that go through their head, so I say "Why don't you give them the taste of their own medicine?"
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Ghost said:
Door knob resembles anus tap.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted August 24, 2012 07:49 PM |
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NoobX there are not that many mass murderers. If you let a few people make the whole Earth rotten for you, that is a shame. Focus on the good people, there are WAY more of those.
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Brukernavn
Hero of Order
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posted August 24, 2012 08:00 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Regarding the apology, he was interrupted by the judge after he said he wanted to apologize to other 'national militants'. What he actually apologized for is therefore heresay, although it's not unlikely he would say something like that.
Here are his words.
Clicky
Quote:
"Since I don't recognize the authority of the court I cannot legitimize the Oslo district court by accepting the verdict," Breivik said. "At the same time I cannot appeal the verdict, because by appealing it I would legitimize the court."
Then, Breivik said he wanted to issue an apology, but it wasn't for the victims, most of the teenagers gunned down in one of the worst peacetime shooting massacres in modern history.
"I wish to apologize to all militant nationalists that I wasn't able to execute more," Breivik said.
I know the media is quoting him, they mentioned it in the press conference afterwards as well, but only as what they heard in the courtroom themselves. It was not recorded in the protocol or heard on the air, since he was interrupted by the judge. (I watched it live).
When his lawyer was asked about it in the press conference afterwards he did not want to comment or repeat what Breivik wanted to say when he was interrupted.
And by the way the quote in cbsnews is actually wrong. This is what he said word by word:
Quote:
"I wish to close with an apology. I wish to apologize to all militant nationalists in Norway and Europe for not being able to.." [sound cut off]
And here's the video, for those who understand norwegian. Video
As I said, it's not unlikely he wanted to say something like that, but it's still heresay. And when they get the audible part of the quote wrong, I'm prone to not put too much weight on the last part.
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted August 24, 2012 10:23 PM |
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Quote:
As I said, it's not unlikely he wanted to say something like that, but it's still heresay. And when they get the audible part of the quote wrong, I'm prone to not put too much weight on the last part.
You can keep repeating that it is hearsay as much as you want, but all the major news organizations say that he apologized to militants for not killing more people.
Now that the ban on him corresponding with people through letters has been lifted he was been quite the letter writter.
Clicky
Breivik is Norway's costliest prisoner. 12.5 million last year year. That is quit a lot of taxpayers required to support the scumbag.
Clicky
Quote:
Anders Behring Breivik has been Norway's costlies person in custody ever. The cost of keeping him at Ila Prison last year has cost NOK 12.5 million.
This is equal to the cost of keeping 15 ordinary prisoners in custody. Regardless of the sentence given on Friday, Breivik will continue to cost Norway NOK several million every year.
Ila Jail has had to spend NOK 12.5 million on security alone, since they were given responsibility for him last summer.
As an example, Ila has had to hire one person extra just in order to screen all the letters Breivik receive, as part of the security measures.
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Revelation
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted August 24, 2012 10:28 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 22:49, 24 Aug 2012.
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Quote:
Because of this kind of people, Earth is a rotten place to live in.
Has always been. Think of it in this way, because of media its easier to know.
Quote:
"Kill", "destroy", "burn" are the thoughts that go through their head,
I dont think so. Killing is indifferent to them. People who murder just dont care about their victims. Killing, setting things on fire and destroying all increase adrenaline which in turn makes them even more violent.
Quote:
so I say "Why don't you give them the taste of their own medicine?"
Not in this world. Evil prevails, always. I am not saying this because I want to sound fearsome or something, I am saying this because there are many more people willing to do bad compared to those that are ready to oppose the corrupt.
Quote:
NoobX there are not that many mass murderers. If you let a few people make the whole Earth rotten for you, that is a shame. Focus on the good people, there are WAY more of those.
Not many? By all means, there are many more than you, me, the statistics or santa knows.
Sometimes, its not just the amunt of people killed that only matter, but the way they are executed aswell.
I can give you examples of murders,mass murders you simply dont want to know about. Given that, I have not seen any of those, but I would rather choose not to, for the safety of my mind.
Sadly, many "God" loving people did crimes. The inquisition, the crusades, Islamic Jihad etc.
If the morals of these "God" loving are not relative, then nothing is. If it was ok 500 years ago to burn women, why is it wrong now?
Because of "God" loving people?
Theism has no moral highground. I am saying this because the occasional troll will troll about how atheists are responsible about warcrimes.
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted August 24, 2012 11:28 PM |
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Quote:
Ila Jail has had to spend NOK 12.5 million on security alone, since they were given responsibility for him last summer.
12 and a half million kroner? That amounts to roughly nothing, unless you are a private person with that money. Its not even a strain.
For the most of this case, instutions who have gotten payeth their upgrades because of this case, have usually been whining for a few years about this already. Its a Norwegian trend to keep on saving, and saving and saving, until death comes. At the least some of the higher court sessions now got a building that is up to modern code, some weird debate about Norwegian decadence is rolling, Ila will get better funded for base security.
So is it costy? No. Whenever there is something expensive in this case, its because they have asked for it for years, and this was finally a good enough excuse to actually upgrade.
So.. expense? *laughs*
If anything, Norway can actually gain a lot from this. 22/7 is after all a mess, and a lot of the mess also comes from systematic nepotism and stagnation in the political system. Of course, the skeptic is most likely right: Current goverment and a few ministers will be scapegoats, the opposition will ignore they rule in roughly the same way, the police will scapegoat a few, but a lot of the internal mess will remain.
So 22/7 for Norway will most likely end up a bit like Oil accidents in more corrupt areas: A few scapegoats might be picked, some routine might be improved, but all in all, the actual improvements are lacking.
Or it could end up with a torching with fire, but the press seems keen on only focusing in the current goverment instead of the systematics errors done time and again.
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted August 24, 2012 11:29 PM |
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Quote:
Theism has no moral highground. I am saying this because the occasional troll will troll about how atheists are responsible about warcrimes.
Must you troll every thread with anti-theist rants?
Theists have lower instances of mental health problems, fewer commit suicide, and more are more charitable givers.  Theism is more healthy for society and for individuals. 
And it is indeed very true that the biggest war-criminals in all of recorded history have been atheists. Why, the mass murderer this thread is about is an atheist or agnostic, though he falsely claimed to share Christian "cultural" values.
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 24, 2012 11:43 PM |
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theist means that he believes in a god, not that he is christian.
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Smithey
Promising
Supreme Hero
Yes im red, choke on it !!!
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posted August 25, 2012 12:10 AM |
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Quote:
Theism is more healthy for society and for individuals.
No its not, in many countries theism discriminates against individuals or minorities/women hence making it a non healthy society... Cant generalize those things...
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This thread is pages long: 
